After the door plug blew off an Alaska Airlines Boeing 737 MAX 9 while inflight in January, aviation safety has become focal. The smallest incidents have been magnified.
It’s seemed like the Summer of the Shark which was the third most covered story of 2001 prior to 9/11, even though shark attacks were actually down compared to the previous year.
At the same time, an outsized number of these incidents have appeared to center around United Airlines. It hasn’t all involved Boeing aircraft, and where it has it hasn’t been new variants or new deliveries of Boeing aircraft. I flew with United three times this week and had zero concerns.
Nonetheless, it’s been broadly covered that the FAA is stepping up inspections of United’s operation. United itself shared this with its employees, and made its employee note public. However the FAAs involvement is far greater than has been revealed publicly.
United has framed this as safety being important to United (it is) and therefore “we’ve stepped up our interactions with the FAA” that “they echoed these sentiments” about the importance of safety and “they agree” with United about the “need to take an even closer look” at the airline’s operation – it’s almost as if United is bringing in the government for help, they’ve asked for involvement, and the FAA has agreed to help. That’s one way of looking at this.
.@FAA_Mike told me this week that @united CEO Scott Kirby "knows we're going to be engaging a little more closely with them as we look into these” recent incidents https://t.co/G0RzN7ItZf pic.twitter.com/yg8isYSOeE
— David Shepardson (@davidshepardson) March 22, 2024
In fact, as aviation watchdog JonNYC was first to report, United Airlines cannot bring any new planes into revenue service and United it appears they cannot add any new routes that they haven’t already announced. In other words, the FAA has halted all growth at United Airlines. They’ve also halted pilot certifications.
"first time in airline history" the thing says
— JonNYC (@xJonNYC) March 23, 2024
..ability to operate and grow our airline. We will also see an increased FAA presence in our daily operation. We are concerned of the damage already done, and this will be long lasting without an immediate and dramatic course reversal.”
— JonNYC (@xJonNYC) March 23, 2024
Depending on how long this lasts, it may have a material effect on the airline’s guidance about growth target and therefore earnings. Generally bureaucracies don’t move quickly when safety is involved. Once they’ve involved themselves, if they lift restrictions too quickly and there’s a subsequent incident, that reflects badly on the agency as much or more than the airline.
Last month regulators grounded a small fleet of United’s planes for stupid reasons, but there have also been incidents worth looking at – even though systems and procedures have worked even when things have gone wrong, and safety hasn’t been compromised.
Shame on United – GS member here and their quality issues have got worse. Most of my flights are delayed extensively due to ‘safety checks’ and maintenance issues. On Thursday this week, on DEN-IAD, we had THREE swaps of the 777 as there were extensive safety and maintenance issues pre and during boarding. I am sure regulators are tracking all of these as we get only the news of in air incidents. Boarding agents criticize United as they deal with the brunt of customer issues and realize how often this happens.
The news about the FAA increasing oversight of UA came late on a Friday when many people are on spring break so the responses so far have been muted.
if Jon is right about, the additional piece of no growth will be stunning.
Scott Kirby has built UA around a high growth model.
The FAA said that resources for “certification activities” will be used to complete oversight of UA which could mean that the Boeing MAX 7, -10, and 777X will be delayed even further.
It is only fair that any airline face the same scrutiny as Boeing.
@ Gary and Tim (not an expert) Dunn
You are both wrong , the FAA did not stop UA from getting airplanes or from training pilots, they did say no more new LCPs. There are so many LCPs now they do not want any newer ones since the old ones are not being used effectively enough.
All those “one off” incidents are all unrelated and overblown by the media, the head of the NTSB said it herself.
Anytime an airline grows a lot or if an airline is in financial distress (ie Spirit) the FAA will step up inspections.
Once again you got it wrong.
30west,
the suggestion that UA growth is being slowed came from jon; I cannot confirm whether he is right or not and said IF it were true, it would be stunning. Jon has made a number of statements that have proven to be not true so the onus is on him, not me or Gary, to see if what Jon says will happen will indeed come to pass.
And, it is fully to be expected that there will be those that deny that the number of UA indicates a problem at UA – but the FAA is not engaging in a top to bottom review of any other airline’s operations. The sheer number of incidents at UA in such a short period of time IS problematic and anyone can objectively see that.
The media rushed to pin all of those incidents on Boeing; given that UA’s fleet is 80% Boeing, it isn’t a surprise that any UA issues would involve Boeing aircraft.
Most of these incidents involve older aircraft – over 10 years old; Boeing was not having quality control issues 10 years ago and other airlines that fly the same aircraft are not having the same problems.
Let the FAA do its job but they clearly have seen things that are concerning about United. TO pretend there isn’t a problem is to deny reality.
@Gary, United’s positioning here is clever. Remember who their head of Comms is. Very smart crew there now in that department. Reframe to make it look like United almost even reached out to the FAA first.
This is the end result of DEI.
The entire airline is falling apart because unqualified people were hired and others were put in positions of power who had no business being there just for DEI purposes.
DEI = DIE
Get woke go broke
there are sources within UA that confirm that UA does not have the ability right now to certify new line check pilots or to issue type ratings which effectively means that they have to work with the pilot trainers and pilots in their current seats that they have – or at the pace that the FAA is willing to allow UA to move.
This means that UA’s hope of replacing lost MAX capacity with A321s will not work.
It is unclear how long the process could drag on but it would be foolish for UA to place a significant order for new A321s within deliveries in the next couple years unless they are willing to retire current A319s/A320s and replace with new A321s.
UA Next was already in serious danger of falling apart; this could push it out even further and erode any competitive advantage that UA thought it would get.
As Ronald Reagan so accurately put it – “the scariest words are – I’m from the government and I’m here to help”
This administration will pander to anyone for the smallest thing (think Biden’s obsession with business fees or blaming food cost on corporate greed versus his own inflationary policies) and will try to stop any merger or micro manage business decisions. We have to run these clowns out of town in November!
The following letter was posted on Airline Pilot Forums and reportedly comes from United’s Orlando union leaders.
ALPA Council 150 is the United MCO Local Council
“Members of Council 150,
We, your elected ALPA Representatives, feel it is our unfortunate responsibility to draw attention to several very concerning items. These issues have, thus far, been inadequately addressed. They pertain to the very core nature of our chosen profession. Simply put, our Safety Culture is under attack and enough is enough. We can not, in good conscience, continue to wait for our Flight Operations Management team to choose safety over anything else. While their words make for great PR, their actions have not matched those words and have directly led to the unfortunate circumstance in which we presently find ourselves. The “United Next” growth plan has seen a staggering 30% growth in just a few short years. However, that growth has come with strings attached. It has come hand in hand with an orchestrated erosion of our Safety Culture and our profession’s input into it. The FAA has similarly witnessed this and recently stepped in to take substantial action against United Airlines. We have lost the ability to approve new Line Check Pilots, issue type ratings, and have regulator-imposed restrictions on our ability to operate and grow our airline. We will also see an increased FAA presence in our daily operation. We are concerned of the damage already done, and this will be long lasting without an immediate and dramatic course reversal.
Who could’ve seen this coming?
Well, for starters, nearly every pilot. We are the ones who have “skin in the game” on every flight. We are the ones with a pulse on the operation. Our concerns have been continuously brushed aside in favor of activities such as Net Promoter Score modules in CQDL, Pilot Professional Development classes with an emphasis on Company feel-good slides, and APU policing. We’ve had these discussions on our flight decks nearly every trip, along with topics like “forced” Captain upgrades, and the continually decreasing flight experience levels of Captains, including instructors and Line Check Pilots.
Unfathomably, in the midst of our latest issues, a VP of a PR related department chastised one of our Captains via United’s “Bravo” recognition app for providing a safe and successful flight. Why? Because our Captain chose to use his time focusing on his crew, preflight duties and preparing for a safe flight, rather than coming out to the aisles to give his departure announcement. This is, in a nutshell, the root of the issues we face.
While Flight Ops Management has allegedly spoken to the individual to assure that doesn’t happen again, it is indicative of a much larger issue. This individual appeared to be less concerned about the safe operation of a flight, than whether the Captain was contributing to that flight’s NPS score, and likely this individual’s bonus.
When we were made aware of this occurrence, the indignation expressed amongst ourselves was loud and clear. Change is needed. It must come with safety as the primary, if not ONLY focus. Exampled by recent actions, Management seems inclined to continue down their path of removing pilot influence from Flight Operations. No longer do we have the SVP of Flight Ops position. Long serving Chief Pilots are leaving their offices and being replaced with Base Directors or whatever they call them now. Make no mistake, this is a prelude to further removing pilots from managing pilots. Human Resources and Labor Relations have never been as far reaching into pilot disciplinary events as they are today, sometimes bordering on harassment of our pilots.
Where does this leave us? Well, for starters, it leaves us as pilots under more scrutiny than ever before. We all need to reinvest in our Safety Culture and do so with vigor. Encourage each other on the flight decks to STOP when rushed, do your best to limit distractions. WHATEVER IT TAKES.
As professionals, we are great at what we do. None better. However, with new risks, comes a need for increased vigilance on each flight. 99.99% success is simply not good enough. Visitors on the flight deck before departure? Maybe ask the FAs to have them stop up afterwards if you’re not completely finished with your preflight duties. Self evaluate and ask if you’re truly ready to be an LCP or a new CA, or are you just chasing a paycheck? A few weeks at TK and OE will not make you ready if you aren’t already. Communicate with each other openly. Don’t skip probationary reports nor merely check the boxes with “great job”. Insist on good debriefings of appropriate items. These are key elements and tools to defend against risk and maintain a safe operation. Refocus on mentoring not just our new pilots, but each other. We are a half step away from the crisis that has been marching steadily towards us. Its now on our doorstep.
The members of your MEC are engaged with Flight Ops Management. We have provided suggestions for restoring our Safety Culture, though it ultimately remains to be seen if they are finally acted upon. The rapid execution of United Next and its promise of financial windfall has been blindly setting us up for this failure, despite our warnings to them which have previously been brushed aside. Hopefully, the FAA action will open some of their eyes and ears to the pitfalls within the changes they steadfastly pursue. Meanwhile, we all need to manage the new risk environment we operate in. The media, the FAA, and our passengers now have their attention focused upon us, the pilots of United Airlines. Every minor issue will be heavily scrutinized. Stay safe and stay out of the headlines.” Members of Council 150,
Tim when you’re dealing with rumors, the best thing to do is use logic before you go all out spreading the rumors.
If the FAA were worried about safety at UA because of maintenance issues, the last thing they would do is prevent UA from using new aircraft. No new routes for the time being maybe, but new aircraft instead of old ones in existing routes is the best you can do for safety. And this implies growth, because UA could replace smaller old metal (and regionals) with bigger ones. UA has plenty of the former to replace and that was in the Next plan since the very beginning. It’s also good for profitability, because the new ones have lower CASM.
You’re exaggerating the impact of this issue on UA financials. The big blow to Next is the lack of MAX 10s, not this.
@ Tim Dunn
I am in a position to know you are incorrect currently.
The MCO rep is correct on 1 of the 3 statements regarding LCPs. The FAA has correctly pointed out UAL does not need more LCPs since Boeing can not deliver the number of airplanes that were planned this year or next so why would the FAA approve more when you are not using the ones you have ?
You and Gary have “Zero” knowledge of what the FAA has said, you are parroting a blogger and an extremely low level comm from the smaller base in the UA system that was misinformed. Got 1 thing sort of correct but not the why.
I can not forecast the future but as of now type rides are being given, the delay of airplanes is still delayed so you need less of everything, pilots , LCAs, mechanics etc. Growth will be reduced as long as airplanes can’t be delivered by manufacturers.
30west,
just stop with the “you don’t know” routine.
I am not saying what the FAA is doing OTHER THAN WHAT HAS BEEN PUBLISHED.
I didn’t publish the letter from the MCO LEC.
Until you post your credentials and tell us what actually is occurring, we will go with what has been published.
And, if this is just a labor-management standoff, the FAA should be capable of figuring that out.
UAL is in the FAA’s crosshairs. I said when these issues were happening in rapid fire that there was something wrong at United and not Boeing where the media wanted to point the blame.
and MSNBC has picked up the story cited by Bloomberg saying that the FAA is considering the restrictions on new routes.
Not that that is in place but the FAA is weighing it.
It is possible that the same LEC people are spreading their version but the chances are high this is real and that you and others just don’t want to face the issue that United is being mismanaged.
United Next has been a massively optimistic growth strategy that is being rolled out at more than twice the rate of GDP, all while UA execs including Scott Kirby have trash-talked the ultra low cost carrier segment of the industry.
There is more than likely fire where there is currently smoke. If it is all true, everyone will know soon.
The airline can no longer self-certify new Captains and LCA’s. An FAA inspector will be required for that.
I am a UAL flight attendant with 34 years of experience. In January this year a male passenger threatened “ to shoot us” if we had a departure delay. This was reported to the captain. He made the decision to keep the passenger on board. I contacted the flight attendant union. I never heard another word. But how is this a safe decision??? After 9-11 how could this behavior be acceptable??Because the captain and the ground supervisor didn’t want to delay the flight further than already delayed because of a mechanical issue.
@Stahl
1. You have zero to do with flight ops.
2. Oh no, someone was mean to you. We both know that if someone truly made a terroristic threat you couldn’t get to the cockpit fast enough and the ca at the minimum would have had the pax removed.
3. Put the phone down and serve some pdbs.
Enough with the delusions.
30west,
If you are in such a lofty position, just prove it or STFU
@ Tim Dunn
You are doing nothing more than parroting rumor and innuendo. Please post the letter from the FAA that says the airline can not grow, it would be a public letter and FOIA able, it’s because there is no letter.
There is a schedule every 5 year inspection starting by the FAA that occurs at all airlines , during that inspection it is desireable to not change variables, like adding flights or adding AC. During the inspection.
Like I have said YOU have zero knowledge simply repeating information from Bloggers who then get their message picked up by major media is NOT news. It is gossip.
if you think that Bloomberg is an unreliable source, take the story up with them.
UAL’s own LEC said there was a major issue.
If UA has had its ability to certify its own line check pilots AT ALL, then that is a sign of a very heavy handed approach by the FAA.
It is United employees, not the media, that is providing the majority of the information that confirms there are significant concerns about United.
You don’t have to convince me. Go the FAA. and your own VP that put out the letter yesterday afternoon after the weekly news focus had already gone home for the weekend.
Looking at Avherald – the rate of other airlines being mentioned is about the same. Even Tim Ds beloved Delta Air Line has incidents listed there. American as well.
Let’s see if we get some more information on what’s going on here. But incidents don’t seem to be a United only problem.
except that it is not, Bill, and the FAA can see it.
Keep in mind that United operates the LEAST amount of flights of the big 4. They fly lots of long flights but their mainline system is considerably smaller than American, Delta or Southwest.
And, once again, the FAA, not me or anyone else on the internet, initiated a certificate evaluation of United but of no other airline.
Trying to point fingers to others is childish – if United has a problem and there are clear signs of it, then it needs to be fixed, regardless of whether someone thinks the other guy has a problem too.
‘I am a UAL flight attendant with 34 years of experience. In January this year a male passenger threatened “ to shoot us” if we had a departure delay. This was reported to the captain. He made the decision to keep the passenger on board. I contacted the flight attendant union. I never heard another word.’
@C. Stahl, you had several options but you chose to keep making money. To be sure, the passenger made a terrorist threat if that is what he said. Was it repeated and/or heard by others? Your action after reporting it to the captain through your chain of command and the captain not having the person removed could have included walking off of the airplane and reporting it directly to airport security. There would be risks to your job but that would have got action, both from security and your union (hopefully in your defense.) If the doors are closed and the jetway has been removed, your actions are limited to what the captain will do. As far as a real safety issue, guns usually don’t make it past TSA but some individuals have opened airplane doors when the doors should have remained shut.
@c.stahl,
which came first, the mx delay or the terrorist threat?
was the terrorist in F or Y?
was the terrorist a company employee interested in NPS?
@jns
tsa misses 90% of fake weapons when tested
what % of real weapons do they miss?
There are some great comments and observations here. The fact that UA and other airlines are having issues filling pilot and other positions is a fact. For years even the pilots union at UA, ALPA has been toting that there is a pilot shortage, now with the age increase being on the table they claim that there is no pilot shortage, well that may be if you say that there are a lot of pilots but take this, how many are QUALIFIED. The diversity issue is not the problem like many are thinking, I have known pilots of both sexes and all different colors and nationalities and you can not say that one is better then the next so throw that out unless you are just wishing on something you are afraid to face.
As far as some of the incidents happening, you have to attribute it to how the people involved with it are 1) trained, 2) supervised, 3) remediated.
UA has been on a very aggressive growth trajectory since the pandemic, they (being management) have not listened to seasoned employees and others familiar with what it takes to train a worker correctly and safely. So with the vision of being “the greatest airline in aviation history” which by the way you can not claim for yourself, it is history and facts that will decide that. The eye on the actual process of bringing growth with safety at a reasonable pace has been focused only on being the biggest. It’s not about the size, it’s the quality vs. quantity.
I would think that the FAA being involved would be a welcome thing BUT will there be a compromise or will it be just a dusting and all returns to same old status quo. We will see and time will tell. This is a wake up call to UAs upper management about the people they are putting in position that can bring the whole thing tumbling downward just because they say that they can get the number where they want.
@hagbard celine, the issue here is specifically a gun per the threat. Which report shows that TSA misses a high percentage of guns?
This author doesn’t understand how (good) regulations and (good) regulators benefit society.
He even approved when the FAA did not initially ground the MAX in 2019, a decision that reduced the global influence of the FAA and the USA (now no county listen to the USA when it comes to aviation matters). Of course, without regulators US flying would be as dangerous as it is in any other unregulated country like many in Africa.
great points, jorge.
It is UA”s high growth and the cut-throat competitive mindset in UA’s C Suite that set UA up for an erosion of safety that everyone can see has happened.
Tim Dunn is a staunch UA and Scott Kirby hater and an extreme Delta Airlines fanatic who would bring up any slightest biased or flawed narrative to prove a point. I’m surprised he’s never mentioned Delta yet in this post.
Dude sounds quite knowledgeable, however his biased and flawed opinions makes him sound like he has no clue about certain topics.
For those saying UA’s recent issues has something to do with DEI should research how aviation certifications works, because you have no clue about what you are talking about. Folks are using this opportunity to voice how uncomfortable they are when marginalized individuals are given a shot in life. How do you know those involved in these recent incidents are women, POC, or LGBTQ !
@ Tim Dunne
As a 40 plus years person in aviation I have learned what you have not Tim and that is not to throw stones at other airlines. It’s only a matter of time until your airline experiences the same issues as your own airline and it’s been an entire week since the panel came off at UAL and now look what happened at DAL, The engine to wing fairing panel came off the SLC to AMS flight and had to divert after it was found on the ground in SLC.
Now do I think that is some issue at DAL on their Airbus that rises to some major safety issue. Or the 2 different engine failures this weekend at Southwest on different days while taking off from two different Florida airports ? Absolutely not a big deal at all the system is working but you and the bloggers get going on sensationalism and spin up nonsense into something. Gary does it for clicks but you do for your own personal belief that your airline of choice is superior in every metric , we can only speculate you do it for some monetary gain. Stock holdings perhaps.