You used to be able to take any open seat in your cabin once the doors closed. You might move closer to the front, grab an aisle seat, or head for an empty row in the back so you could stretch out.
As a kid I remember making a bee-line for an empty middle row on an American Airlines flight from Honolulu to Sydney, so I could lay down and sleep.
- Self-upgrading was never allowed. You couldn’t just move from economy to business class.
- Now, though, airlines charge for ‘premium’ seats in coach so they don’t usually let you go from regular coach to extra legroom seats for free, even if the seats are empty once the doors close.
- People might not pay if they knew they could take an extra legroom seat for free that was empty once everyone had boarded!
On a recent American Airlines flight a flight attendant “tore the cushions off” empty extra legroom Main Cabin Extra seats so that passengers couldn’t sit there.
A passenger went to sit in these empty seats. No one was using the six empty seats. The flight attendant said he needed to move because they were $150. Someone else went to sit there and told the same thing. An announcement was made not to sit in the seats. Two more times ppl went to sit there because it was six seats open, and he literally tore the cushions off.
Post by @summerzcrystalView on Threads
The flight attendant said these are $150 seats, but didn’t offer to sell them. Crewmembers at American don’t have the ability to upsell these, like they do at some other airlines, which is a lost revenue opportunity but the airline is very careful about making IT investments.
Years ago open seats were pretty much fair game. Now different airlines take different approaches. Southwest still has open seating! And once you’re on the plane it’s Lord of the Flies complete with seat-saving and crumpled up tissues to keep people away from the middle seat they hope to save.
Delta calls their extra legroom seats at the front of the plane “Comfort+” and it’s a different fare type. Effectively, it’s a different cabin just like coach is different than business class (yet doesn’t pay the higher tax for this demanded by the U.K.).
When American Airlines introduced free drinks to Main Cabin Extra extra legroom seats they allowed passengers to move into these seats if empty.
Then they made it officially against the rules but left it up to flight attendants whether or not to stop passengers from moving into those seats. However, two years ago began asking flight attendants to crack down on passengers moving to get extra space for free.
It’s not unusual for Main Cabin (MC) customers to ask to change seats after they’ve boarded the aircraft – to sit next to a family member or get out of a middle seat, for instance. However, customers may not be familiar with our seat change policy; particularly when it comes to Main Cabin Extra (MCE) seats. While you may allow a customer to move to an available Main Cabin seat after boarding is complete, they’re not permitted to move into an MCE seat unless they are booked in that class. So, if a customer asks to move to a seat in a different seat classification (i.e., MC ot MCE, MCE to First, etc.) politely decline their request unless there is a customer service or regulatory conflict present.
In the past, United has argued that passengers moving up to open seats with extra legroom is immoral; that it’s unfair to other passengers and it’s stealing from the airline.
The customers who choose to pay for Economy Plus are then afforded that extra space. If you were to purchase a Toyota, you would not be able to drive off with a Lexus, because it was empty. ^BA
— United Airlines (@united) September 7, 2019
But according to this logic United shouldn’t be able to sell cheap fares or offer MileagePlus awards because it is unfair to people that pay full fare? Of course passengers who buy Economy Plus get Economy Plus and are in no way harmed when other passengers get it free – via elite status, via luck of the draw or otherwise.
Sitting in an open seat that can never be sold (because the plane is already in the air) is not the same thing as taking a physical car off of a lot where it is waiting to be sold. In the former case United loses nothing, in the latter case the loss is real.
It seems strange to compare United slimline economy seats to a Lexus, although I once had a flight attendant compare Economy Plus to a Mercedes.
The better argument is: we do not allow passengers to move to better seats without paying extra (except under our own terms, for our operational convenience or elite perks) because that would encourage passengers to take a chance rather than paying on future trips. The actual reason: It’s not allowed because we don’t allow it, not because of some broader moral imperative.
Comparing changing to an open seat nobody else is using can’t be stealing, because the airline hasn’t given up anything, and claiming it harms other passengers isn’t right either because other passengers still got exactly what they paid for.
(HT: Johnny Jet)
I’m totally fine with this. This is a different product at a different price and American has a right to stop people from stealing this service without paying . . . which is starting to seem like an odd concept in the United States where stealing has been decriminalized in many places. The fact that the seat is empty is irrelevant.
I’m on airlines side. there are waaay too many people would follow suit if airlines didn’t stop them.
My type of FA wouldn’t care about seat cushions , and also wouldn’t care about the underwear rule . Rules can be ignored .
While I’ve never attempted to move to a seat outside the price of the seat that I have paid for, I cannot suppress a chuckle over an FA actually physically removing the seat covers. I have to wonder what would happen if he injured himself during the endeavor.
Would the flight be delayed, or cancelled for being one crewmember short?
Would an injury compensation claim ensue?
Now, contrast this against the idea of helping the 80 year old woman stow her Carry-on in the overhead bin. We’ve already seen that movie. It’s a ~ you brought it, you lift it over your head ending. For fear of injury, not covered by Workers Comp.
Hmmm… just doesn’t feel like defacing the interior of the airplane is a good use of one’s time.
So if I buy a ticket to a ball game in the cheap seats, and I see there are open seats right behind home plate, I can just go down and take those, right? Because it’s not like they can be sold once the game has started.
If I buy nosebleed tickets to a Taylor Swift concert and I see with my binoculars that a couple of the front row seats are empty, I can just go down and take those right? Because it’s not like they can sell them once the concert has started.
@Bob Spoons +1
The United States has become a nation of moochers who can rationalize anything with their malignant sense of entitlement that somehow absolves them of their need to buy or produce the things that they want.
This is the world we live in. If I can’t afford something I should be given it anyway. While it might seem on the surface allowing flight attendants to sell empty MCE seats seems like a good idea boarding is hectic and chaotic enough without people trying to buy a better seat and slowing down the process. Not to mention what happens when two or more passengers ask to buy up for the same seat. If getting extra leg room is that important a MCE seat can be purchased ahead of time.
What people don’t realize is that the people who buy the extra legroom seats are guaranteed their seats. Not so with the people who buy the cheaper seats. It costs the airline nothing to let people move to the extra room seats. It’s like a couple who choose a window seat and an aisle seat hoping that the middle seat will be empty. It’s a gamble. Sometimes you win and sometimes you lose. Is the airline going to make more money with this policy? Answer: NO. And it makes for negative feelings among the customers.
The photos are showing exit row seats. These seats have specific rule requirements FAA Federal Aviation Regulations and Title 14 Code of Federal Regulations to sit there, which may include (per the airline a higher price for the additional
Comfort) but the reality is if something happens you are committing to assist in an emergency.
@BobSpoons … If you pay for any ticket to Taylor Swift , you have paid too much . If you find yourself accidently at Taylor Swift , you ought to Run Away .
Fine with what the FA did. If you don’t enforce, then you disincentive people from paying for the better seats as they think they’ll can move seats every flight.
It would be easier for the FA just to first warn and then log the offending passenger and have AA IT send an email with an invoice after the fact. Of course that requires a good IT setup.
In their passion for nickel and diming their clients, US airlines forget they have alternatives. We now take foreign airlines to fly abroad, or even boats, and thus deprive US airlines of thousands in revenues… and it feels good.
IMHO, @Arturo is not correct. As Gary correctly identified, pax are paying an additional $ 150 to sit in Economy Plus/Extra/Premium. It’s no different than pax paying even more for Business or First Class. It’s an entirely different class of seat, so no, someone in Economy can’t simply take it at no cost (which would constitute theft). As for the thought that “it makes for negative feelings among the customers”, this argument is backwards: For certain the pax who paid for higher classes are going to be pissed if others get them for free, and no pax booked in economy has a right to be pissed for not getting a higher class for free.
It is possible that economy fare passengers could have been left at the gate because that section was sold out. They declined to pay for the upgrade and the door was closed. Now an economy fare passenger on board wants to grab a freebie, not fair. Besides, you are now sitting next to me who paid extra for that same class service, free drinks, snacks and space. Bravo for American and the FA. If you want open seating call Southwest before they go multi class seating themselves.
@BobSpoons I like that you got me thinking on your comment, but it isn’t the same. Usually the usher does not know if those premium seats were bought and the patron can arrive anytime during the concert and the usher doesn’t want to deal with removing someone during the event. This cannot happen once the flight leaves the gate. (Also, FA knows whether the seats were sold)
What flights have empty seats on them? None of the flights I’ve been on in the last several years has had any empty seats, and even my Gold status has me at 16 or higher on the upgrade list. I don’t know why the FA’s bother on those extremely rare flights with empty seats.
@Gary any crew member that injured themselves doing this would have been unfit to fly in the first place. The seat cushions are held on by velcro, nothing else.
I’ve been in an extra legroom seat and was lucky no one booked the center seat next to me. Someone from a center seat in back wanted to poach it but the flight attendant prevented it. Thanks! It would have made my flight a bit worse.
I get not letting people take these seats for free. It devalues the product. But having these “classes within a class” seats contributes to a bigger problem.
Years ago when online seat selection began, you could pay extra to choose specific seats. A nice perk. But today so many take advantage of it, that a small family of 3-4 is practically required to pay extra, in advance, just to sit together. That shouldn’t be a thing. And having these economy subdivision seats makes a smaller pool of regular seats, worsening the problem.
I really don’t get the bashing of the Airline and the FA in this instance. If I had paid for a nicer seat and people were coming up to take them, I would actually applaud the FA for doing all 3 things they did. Asking passengers to move back to their assigned seats, making an announcement, then taking off the cushions. The problem is with THE PASSENGERS who have no regard for the rules, what they are told, and try to do whatever they want. Society needs to go back to shaming people who behave badly.
Those who have paid for extra legroom or earned it through loyalty programs expect their purchase to hold value. Allowing others to grab those seats for free undermines that. Discounts or freebies mid-flight would create a double standard, leading paying customers to feel cheated. Airlines have every right to enforce these policies strictly—if passengers want extra space, they need to pay like everyone else. Empty seats don’t entitle anyone to a free upgrade, and bending the rules would only devalue the experience for those who followed them.
I usually don’t support AA FAs on anything but this time I think the FA did the right thing.
I’ve being traveling for business for over 20 years and American airline is the worst airline I’ve come across. They’re all about money,their customer service sucks,they’re always late. Their prices are always ridiculous. The best airline hands down is Southwest.
It is theft because if you move to A higher class you get other perks (free drinks and such)
Bravo to the FA.I’m tired of all the people who think they are entitled to do whatever they want and justify it any way they want to. This is an obnoxious society and the book “The Ugly American” was way ahead of its time.
I wouldn’t care about the seat, but one thing it’s really bother me is that the seat the airline assigned for the passengers. When I booked airfare for family, that means I wanted family members should sit close to each other for taking care of the family members (kids, aged parents ). But I had few times, the airline assigned the seats for my family members in different areas and I could take care of my kids, spouse, parents…. Do you think it is the right thing for them to do that or they just want to sale the seats to make more money?? Because if you want family members sit close to each other, you have to get in the website to buy the seats early or you may lose it.
All airlines need to find a way to not TORTURE passengers with ass-pinching, leg crushing seats. We are not 6th graders!! Find a way to give everyone a seat that reclines, and everyone would be happy with a box lunch and a couple of paid beverage services. Passengers get mad, deceitful and anxious to get something better because they are UNCOMFORTABLE. Airline seats in economy are CRUEL. They never used to be.
Local police could authorize American Airlines cabin crew to make upgrades once the plane door is shut.
I have since stopped flying American Airlines. Why would I want to fly with an airline that hates me as a passenger? Flight attendants that work for American are generally more rude. It’s like they hate passengers. And when passengers don’t feel loved, they go somewhere else.
If I chose to upgrade my seat for 75$ and after the door closes and someone move to a 75$ seat for free, do I get my 75$ back
Good for the FA in this story. I would be and am very bothered by people taking empty higher priced seats. If they were up for grabs, it should be announced and a lottery or something provided to everyone for an equal chance at them. But since that’s not the case, let’s not encourage the people who seem to think their self proclaimed wit and unabashed audacity is all it takes to get better seats, and think the other poor souls who were not quick thinkers are undeserving.
This is a lack of imagination on AAs part. If there was an extra legroom seat available and I was in coach, I would GLADLY pay the upcharge to move. First come, first serve. As for the IT complexity angle, they don’t need to make it a full ticket, they can put the seat charge on the same menu as the Meal/Drink charges. It would just be like a $150 alcoholic beverage or cola or bag of nuts.
Sad reality is that these corporations are making whimsical rules and folks dont have an alternate option! Corporations now own our and most govts ! The pendulum will slowly swing back as automatic flying machines are within 20 yrs horizon!
They are exit row seats – you can’t just randomly sit in them. You should know better.
If the Plane is in the air .. chances of adding a passenger is nil . So that seat will be empty for the duration of the flight. For the comfort of myself and the passenger siting next to me I would love to relocate to an unoccupied seat just for the shared benefits it offers. IT’S AN EMPTY SEAT! So now they are trying to charge you for a seat they did not sell. SMFH. This is not the FA fault. It’s a job. You gotta enforce their policies. But AA is becoming like Spirit now. What next the oxygen we breathe while in flight?!
15 comments and no one has noticed the pic of “ripped-off” seat cushions shows the FA altered the configuration of an exit row.
The FA committed a Federal Crime if this took place in US airspace.
On this one, I agree with the FA’s. If you didn’t pay for the seat before getting on the aircraft, you can’t sit there. Its that simple. I wouldn’t walk into a store and pay $10 for merchandise and walk out with $50 worth of stuff. In that past before extra legroom seats were for purchase or upgrade with miles, that might have been fine. But lots of things change.
One thing though, FA’s should be able to take a credit card and charge for an open extra legroom seat once the door is closed.
I just flew from Detroit to Philly on AA. It was very nice. The flight attendant was great. I unfortunately didn’t get his name. Then on the flight from Philly to Quebec, those attendants were very nice. I am in agreement with the idea that people nowadays are in the mindset that they are entitled to everything.
Who would be liable for removing and denying aircraft survival equipment to American
Airlines passengers when flight attendants remove the flotation seat cushions, which are the primary means for passenger flotation used in conjunction with a life vest, in the event of an emergency aircraft ditching into the water – the flight attendants, the airline, or both?
It’s because they’re in the same cabin … no curtains or signs to indicate it’s different. A hefty percentage of passengers don’t know they’re ‘special’, just like old times expect they can take any empty seat.
Almost no one pays the extra $75, $100, or $150 for the main cabin extra seats or exit rows. The majority of people who sit there are those with Elite status, that allows them to select those seats for free.
So it’s more about preserving Elite status benefits. Not because of losing money or stealing, neither of which are really true.
That said, I’m not opposed if someone wishes to move into an empty main cabin extra row. But if they decide to plop themselves down beside me, taking the empty middle seat, I wouldn’t be too happy with that. Not unless they are a slim, pretty young lady who wants to flirt me with! 😉