The standard allowable time for evacuating an aircraft under FAA and European rules is 90 seconds. Airlines have to simulate these evacuations to show that the way they configure planes make this possible. In an emergency, people need off an aircraft quickly.
But these simulations don’t assume people stopping to grab their luggage. That’s what passengers do! Some experts argue that overhead bins should lock to prevent passengers from grabbing bags, but that would only slow things down further as everyone tries to fight to get the bins open, not understanding that they’re locked.
And the simulations don’t assume people stopping to take selfies, film the situation for social media, or record their heading down the emergency slide. But who ever figures that passengers would simply lollygag their way out of the plane during an evacuation – or stop to argue with flight crew over whether they need to get up at all?
On Friday an American Airlines flight from San Francisco to Miami had to evacuate while still at the gate when a passenger’s laptop caught fire. Passengers exited via both emergency slides and the still-attached jet bridge. But they didn’t do so in a very orderly manner.
Video from inside the cabin shows a flight attendant yelling at passengers not to take their carry-on bags, and even arguing with a passenger over whether or not he needed to go at all. Passengers can be seen remaining seated. Overhead bins are open. And you can even see people still reaching in to grab their bags, even as they’re being told not to – and to get off the plane! This is literally insane.
Latest video footage shows the tensed moments after a laptop battery caught fire inside the American Airlines flight at SFO.
Flight attendants and the pilot can be heard asking passengers to leave their bags and get off the plane.
At least three people were injured during the… https://t.co/KHXT3dxqFm pic.twitter.com/QW5eeY9tKs
— FL360aero (@fl360aero) July 13, 2024
This 90-second rule is based on the assumption that an aircraft needs to be evacuated quickly in case of an emergency to maximize the chances of survival and minimize injuries. But it doesn’t assume the real world of how passengers actually behave.
The truth is that the rule still works. Usually there’s more than 90 seconds available, and when you add in the time for how people actually behave the theoretical standard and real world available time mostly sync up.
In the American Airlines evacuation, there were only a few minor injuries. It isn’t clear though whether there was Venn diagram overlap between injured passengers and idiot passengers.
You do not know how long you have to evacuate an aircraft, and as passengers or even crew you probably don’t have full information about the risks in front of you. The goal is to get out and away from the aircraft as quickly as possible. That means not slowing down to get bags or crowding the aisle with bags. It means no selfies. Maybe you’ll get out in time anyway – but will everyone behind you?
In any group of people there will be a subset of Darwin’s. You can only hope they are behind you.
Only in USA. Me me me.
Guarantee my ground support in a reasonable period of time — <1 hour — for keys, cash, cards, ID, onward travel, replacement of property, etc etc etc, and I'll leave my stuff. Otherwise it's coming with me.
Can’t baggage,high heels anything sharp etc damage the emergency slides?
Folks are crazy today in a plane or driving recklessly in an alternate universe
I run from most of them as fast as I can
Scary reminder of who and what you are flying with
Just look at many trying to board or deplane holding up an entire flight as
If it’s there own bedroom
Sad cattle
Future Darwin Award winners!
Sure it seems insane after the fact. During the moment, it’s just huan nature.
Took 8 minutes to order the evacuation of the JAL A350 on January 2nd and another 10 minutes to get everybody off using three exits. And the average Japanese person is going to follow instructions much better than the average American. 90 seconds is never going to happen, especially in an actual full on emergency.
Ah yes, The Human Race. Devolving right before our eyes.
Is that enough to get you on the airline’s no fly list?
Few will admit this, but this is precisely why Cabin Crew need to hold themselves out as serious professionals, and not goofballs with tattoos, blue hair, nose rings, and PLO Flag pins. If you act like a fool, people will consider you a fool and not follow your instructions. If you want to be taken seriously, hold yourself out as a serious professional and dress the part.
How long did it take for people to get their bags back, and how was that done? Did people reboard the plane to get their stuff?
Thinning out the herd. what a bunch of idiots !
Everyone who followed instructions should be rewarded in some fashion. That will help assure some of the Darwins will comply, they like rewards. Those who don’t should be charged with interference with a large fine and mandatory jail time. Also lock those overhead bins.
Thx for this useful post, Gary. I believe I’d act responsibly under such circumstances. But it’s still a good reminder to all of us to prioritize safety and crew instructions.
The solution is very simple- anyone who gets off the aircraft with a bag is handcuffed and arrested on the tarmac. They will be charged with failing to obey crew members directions. And the F/A’s need to make this announcement as they are telling people to evacuate. Spending a few hours in custody will make the point and it needs to be broadcasted on the news.
I support Walter in the desire to value “stuff” over life, they should have a non-exit row window seat and be the last to exit to ensure they have all thier stuff in hand! By patiently waiting for others to exit it will provide ample time to check the contents and ensure nothing is left in seat back pocket
I’m curious about the vac slides being deployed while the jetway was still attached. If the main door is open and jetway is attached, aren’t the other exit doors unarmed? I wonder if there is a way to activate slides in unarmed mode?
It’s coming with me hell or Highwater. I’m not waiting for these clowns to return my luggage
The 90 second evacuation “standard” is a complete JOKE! The actual demonstration is always carried out with airline personnel who have been fully briefed with total advance notice. Glitches such as the ones experienced here in a real evac are never part of the demo. One of these days there is going to be a very tragic incident that disproves this norm and then the FAA may wake up. Of course, the airlines will sandbag any changes for years to save money.
The epitome of California entitlement! They are entitled to their seat despite the risk of being engulfed. Well they are entitled to burn too!
Clearly this was a failed evacuation. With that said, let’s be real: if I have my handbag with me under the seat, I’m not just leaving it. I’m not getting stuff out of the overhead and I’m not rifling through bags to get things out of it, but I’m grabbing my Tumi handheld which is already at my feet and rolling. It literally adds zero time to the swift exit motion – up, out of the seat, into the aisline, onto the slide. The pain of reconstructing some of the items present in that bag make it worth it. Again, I’m leaving my clothes bag and rollaboard and all of the other shit. Not worrying about things in seatback pockets. But my briefcase bag, which is right there, full of passports and ID cards and things it would take days or weeks of painstaking effort or reconstruct, which adds no time to my exit, is coming with me. Deal with it.
After a tragic aircraft cabin fire many years ago, I anticipated that premium airlines would give elite-status passengers and platinum credit card holders the option to choose their seating preference: non-smoking, smoking, or burnt beyond recognition.
“Only in USA. Me me me.” The guy refusing to move forward and arguing sounded very much like a foreigner from Europe.
I have my passport on my body, at least below 10,000 feet. If I jump, I jump with it. The rest can wait.
@Daniel: You wrote, “The epitome of California entitlement! They are entitled to their seat despite the risk of being engulfed. Well they are entitled to burn too!”
The State of California Cemetary and Funeral Bureau is concerned about the traumatic experience of being burnt alive during a delayed flaming aircraft evaluation due to passengers taking extra time to retrieve heir baggage from the overhead bins. As a result, California citizens who have been burned beyond recognition should receive a special entitlement discount of half price on cremation.
From what I have read on this topic people who have been through one disaster are much more attuned to being proactive in saving themselves from another. There have been cases in an emergency situation (not necessarily air) where people sat stunned and did not vacate until someone took charge. More to the point, people don’t always listen–and I’m not talking about just Americans or Californians or any other group. One of the worst examples of this was in 1996 when Ethiopian Flight 961 was hijacked and ran out of fuel off the Comoro Islands. Despite instructions not to inflate their life jackets while they were inside the aircraft, a significant number of passengers did just that. When the ocean came in they were floated away from the openings and towards the sinking aircraft’s ceiling.
Miami bound transcon flight what do you expect from that crowd any more than what you see on the roads there – disproportionate amount of selfish, not very aware folks
Part of the issue is it wasn’t the emergency they made it out to be – not much smoke, lots of open doors, and they’re sitting at a gate with the jetway attached so folks had some dissonance
But as Mak said this is why crews need to be more professional at all times in their appearance and demeanor
And watching more closely the guy yelling at the crew is the guy with the laptop that caught fire.
The fire was out then and there and he was pointing that out. No more smoke, no more flames. this video was from the point of view of the source of the ignition.
Frankly listening to him might have avoided some injuries.
By the time of the video they had thrown the laptop out of the plane (prob through that open door) as he was pointing out
The American cult of selfishness at its finest.
Yet people love to blame U.S. airline employees for everything, even though they constantly have to deal with these horrible types of rude and entitled people.
This video explains what happened. The guy in blue yelling back and his son telling the story. Both from Austria.
Laptop in backpack under his seat in back row or almost back row smoked and caught fire. He and his son got up to open the rear door to throw it out. Flight attendant said no. Son opened door anyway then asked if they could throw the backpack out. She said no, but dad (man in blue) said throw it out there anyway.
https://www.tiktok.com/@pressdemo/video/7390912631650946346?_r=1&_t=8nzQBNfms9f
Evacuation was ordered after that. And we get to the video here where he says it’s all out, no longer in the plane, pushing back against the FA.
Obviously they were wrong to disobey the FA, although in reality their actions were more risky to themselves and beneficial to others in the cabin – getting the laptop out quickly. But they interfered with crew.
And there was not much need for evacuation at that point.
I can understand why some people are trying to get their carryon luggage, especially if they could see that the danger had been dealt with. I was taking the Airport MRT from downtown Taipei to the Taoyuan airport. The rapid transit train broke down, and we had to walk the rail line 1000’s of feet above ground to the next station. They told us to leave our luggage on the broken down train. Luckily I did not have any luggage other than a small backpack. But if you followed their directions & didn’t take your luggage as many did, then you pretty much lost your luggage as there was no way you could have been reunited with it in any timely manner. They were completely unorganized and they left us on our own to get to the airport. I barely made my international flight, after hitching an Uber ride with a local.
@ Daniel
Your snipe about Californians falls flat. If you actually read the story you would have learned that all of the so-called “entitled” passengers chose Florida as their preferred destination. Otherwise, they would have stayed in California.
I would like to know who gave the evacuation order especially when still at gate with boarding door open and accessible.
Mak also has a very good point.
Any 90 second evacuation is fake news. Every plane includes multiple elderly passengers who take at least 5 minutes to get off a plane. And these folks would clog the aisle and prevent others from a timely evacuation.
I disagree with you on the overhead bins. If people know that they’re locked and just can’t be opened then they will either not bother at all or try once and give up before doing what they’re supposed to – get out fast.
How did the dozens of people in wheelchairs make it out in 90 seconds?
The door exits are disarmed at the gate when the jet bridge/stairs are attached and boarding door open. It takes a second (literally) to ‘arm’ the door on an Airbus so you get a slide. There is a backup manual inflation handle if it dosent deploy.
I can see why the aft FA was hesitant about throwing a smoking bag on the ramp. In the momemt…for all they knew the laptop was predicate to a larger problem prompting the evac order and that exit would be unusable with a fire on the tarmac.
We can get into the social psychology at work here but flapping my arms and trying to fly to the moon would be more productive.
Solution to people who refuse to listen. When everybody is evacuated and on the tarmac — create two groups
#!1= People with carry on bags, etc. (The people who did not listen to instructions.)
#2 = People who have nothing on them. (The people who listened to instructions.)
When it is time to board the plane and leave — only the people in group #2 are allowed to get on the plane (whether it’s the original plane or a replacement). The people in group #1 are put onto a NATIONWIDE do not fly list. (We need to create a nationwide do not fly list.)
@TW
Amen. I share your concerns.
I hope to not be part of the inevitable mass casualty botched evacuation that it will take for change.
These people who wanted their belongings taken out & didn’t listen to the evacuations instructions should get criminally charged like intention to commit murders or even barred from flying for the rest of their lives to let those responsible in that flight & future passengers to learn a lesson.
What’s with the Anti USA crap? This happens everywhere:
https://www.google.com/imgres?q=evacuated%20plane%20fire%20taking%20carry%20on%20luggage&imgurl=https%3A%2F%2Fexternal-preview.redd.it%2F3r3nOvpeQaohOHetxkop1kvhl__eVqUbLyGdP4bVogw.jpg%3Fauto%3Dwebp%26s%3De16af9c104326810f9eb2a87ff2b5c82a2e5b241&imgrefurl=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.reddit.com%2Fr%2Fflying%2Fcomments%2F1hrts0%2Ftaking_your_bags_off_of_a_burning_plane_is_a_crime%2F&docid=45ckaekiN4AYXM&tbnid=Q1-Vt857MmAr8M&vet=12ahUKEwjdq5bblqWHAxUyHkQIHekKBJ4QM3oECBgQAA..i&w=1822&h=890&hcb=2&ved=2ahUKEwjdq5bblqWHAxUyHkQIHekKBJ4QM3oECBgQAA
Let me be clear: there need to be laws making it a FELONY to retrieve bags during evacuation.
Also, any passenger who does this deserves a permanent ban, as well as forfeiture of any AAdvantage miles. The only way people will care is if there’s actual penalties.
@H2oman. See: Air France 358 Toronto. It absolutely can be done in 90 seconds and thank God they did on that flight.
Half of the population is below average . . .
Think about that one.
It looks like the flight attendant was the biggest hindrance in this video, she opened the door when the slide wasn’t armed causing this exit useless for exit
You can’t control human behavior…
Guy in the video not following instructions was clearly speaking German, so highly unlikely to be American…
Ignorance and arrogance is a bad combo these days! Listen to your crew’s instructions instead of playing with your phone. TikTok won’t save your life in an emergency evacuation.
There’s a reason why you’re given safety instructions by the crew “ DO NOT BRING LUGGAGE or anything with you during an evacuation ! Why ? Because it simply it slows down evacuations. The aisles becomes blocked with passengers panicking having trouble lifting bags. They take their time then they either pile up at the exits or at they end up at the slides.
The FAA put in place certain protocol for a good reason, to get out as quickly as we can out of the airplane in an emergency situation. They have done multiple studies on all evacuations on record. In addition, passengers are not allowed to film while evacuating an aircraft as it’s against federal aviation law. It blocks the aisles for all trying to move quickly and get out safely. Besides having luggage in your hands while going down the slide at a steep rate is unthinkable.
You can’t hold on to the slides in the first place as you can burn your hands due to friction. Passengers are unable to focus on landing on their feet at the end while having luggage in their hands, and end up tumbling out of control going down. This usually ends up with broken bones lacerations or sometimes even fatal due to a broken neck.
Questions to ask yourself! Where’s my closest exit? How do I open it? Listen to your crew ! What exits should I not open during an emergency? The Captain usually makes a PA when time permits on which exits not to use. Should I open an exit if there’s an engine still on? Should open an exit if it’s partially or under water or if if I see danger such as fire or debris outside the window? How do I open my exit? Is it power assist ? If so you could it will throw you out as it opens under pressure! If you’re a passenger, yes that concerns you. If you’re an non-ambulatory passenger and can’t move on your own, wait for assistance from a either a crew member at the very end of the evacuation or with the help of a fellow passenger if able to move quickly. Always assist your crew if you’re asked to help! Don’t act like a crew member when you’re not trained as one!
This incident highlights why flight attendants really need to focus on their core mission to serve food and beverages to the passengers. Every decision they made in this situation was terrible. The passengers had far more sense then they did in opening the door and throwing the dangerous object out. Then the useless flight attendants needlessly evacuated the airplane, putting the passengers in greater danger. Idiocy and incompetence at every level.
First and foremost,
A passenger is never allowed to touch, arm , or disarm an open a commercial aircraft’s doors unless instructed to do so by a the flight crew.or if the are incapacitated to do so because they’re hurt . It is their responsibility as they are qualified and certified per FAA.
An aircraft’s doors are never armed while on the ground until the left front entry that you boarded from is closed , passengers with seatbelts fastened and the aircraft is ready for push back.
There’s many other reasons why emergency slides would never be used. The aircraft was sitting at the gate, jet bridge still hooked up to the plane while passengers were still boarding , or still
On the aircraft with service trucks attached to its doors or cargo compartments with luggage ramp attached to it and tug with baggage cart attached still loading bags or unloading. Slides have many thousands of pounds of pressure in order to push it outside of the aircraft from its container called “ slide pack” in order to deploy with pressure. That very pressure can injure someone near or even kill someone in the process. If a a flight attendant shouts “ this exit blocked use another “ that He or she will redirect you to is a very good reason. There could be fire, debris or service vehicles blocking that slide to be used. In an evacuation. This type of evacuation is called “ unplanned evacuation “ where the flight crew adjusts the emergency evacuation to re-arm the slides that are useable in this situation. A flight attendant may have thought that particular exit was unusable due to something blocking it, it may have jammed while trying to arm it. Also in some cases passengers would just walk out fast but normally thru the front door on left if the jet bridge is attached.
It is never allowed for passengers to challenge or prevent a uniform crew member to effectively evacuate an aircraft in an emergency situation. It’s absurd that someone decides to bring a brand name or not personal carry on while evacuating an aircraft as it could potentially prevent passengers from safety getting out on time which is usually 90 seconds. Time is crucial and yes you will be shouted at if you freeze whether you decide to go down the slide or not or that not to bring your bag down the slide with you. The bags slow down evacuations , all are on record per FAA and test studies are made to improve time to effectively evacuate you safely. Don’t be a Mr. Or Mrs. Know it all, don’t argue with the flight crew and follow their instructions.
Things that could puncture a slide and could make it unusable in an emergency are high heel shoes, sharp objects and even your suitcase that got damaged or has sharp edges. So don’t do it it’s not worth your life.
Passengers should always be wearing shoes on an airplane and it is mandatory per FAA’s instructions for that very reason. When sliding down there’s no time to think and it’s so fast. In a planned emergency, for example, the flight crew will ask for volunteers to assist inside sometimes to keep the flow of the evacuation with passengers, or to guard an exit that is unusable or blocked. Sometime other times to assist passengers once off the aircraft at the bottom of the slide so no one gets hurt at the end of it.
Educate yourself prior to making assumptions about how an evacuation should be performed or that the crew is in the wrong. In an emergency situation the adrenaline is pumping and many people have different reactions. Imagine the crew . Crew members are there much more than to serve you that drink. Their primary duties is to safety get you out of the aircraft alive. They also are trained with CPR and much more that the flying public has no idea about . So before you make an uneducated decision to criticize them please think twice.
Be kind to one another and to your crew. Many hours of work are often for free. That aircraft is on the ground with the door open and not until the aircraft pushed back and go forward again turning its front wheel that they get paid. Lately only two US carriers Crew members are paid the rest aren’t . ( SW and Alaska ). The rest of them truly do it because they have a passion for the industry. So listen to your crew and pay attention to the announcements on the aircraft . This could be important to you.