American Airlines and its flight attendants union were summoned to a rare Saturday meeting in Washington, D.C. by the National Mediation Board.
After talks this month failed to yield a contract that both parties could accept, the union told flight attendants to prepare to strike. The Mediation Board had not scheduled additional bargaining sessions. The union said the talks that already occurred were a last ditch effort. They believed they would be released into a 30-day cooling off period and then allowed to strike.
There was much speculation that this was going to happen on Saturday. I offered the reasons I did not think that was a likely outcome. The Mediation Board did not tell the parties that they were being released to ‘self-help’.
Instead, the Association of Professional Flight Attendants told its members that negotiations continue.
American already increased its financial offer during negotiations. That alone gives the Mediation Board the fulcrum around which they can claim that no impasse has been reached.
Airline strikes are rare in the United States. There have been two in the last 20 years – Northwest mechanics in 2005 and Spirit Airlines pilots in 2010. They are damaging to the economy, and to the President’s popularity, since the President can order a delay to the strike. President Clinton headed off strikes both by American Airlines pilots and flight attendants during his time in office.
The National Mediation Board is politically-appointed, with a current majority selected by the President. Allowing a strike would put the President in an untenable position, forced to choose between his labor constituency and median voters in states like in Pennsylvania, North Carolina, and Arizona where American has major hubs. Airfares would spike during the strike, removing a significant portion of inventory from U.S. air travel.
It’s taking too long to reach a deal – with both parties and circumstances beyond everyone’s control at fault. Now it seems we’re more likely to reach a deal without a strike.
- The move by the Mediation Board to extend negotiations increases the likelihood of a negotiated settlement, but potentially reduces the bargaining leverage of flight attendants. (We do not know exactly what was said.)
- The flight attendants union – which has significantly curtailed its demands – faces the weakest of the large carriers from which to seek the most lucrative contract first. That’s a tall order. Flight attendants are far more likely to do incrementally better than Delta.
- It’s taking an excruciatingly long time to reach a deal. The last raise flight attendants received was January 1, 2019 and inflation has substantially eroded the value of their pay since then.
- A contract was first delayed by the pandemic. The union wouldn’t have wanted to negotiate terms then (the deal they’d have gotten would not have been good).
- Union leadership started bargaining with a position far outside the zone of possible agreement, and then had to wait until union officers were re-elected to walk that back.
- Given how much time has gone by, they’d have been much better off American’s offer to pay flight attendants more as an interim measure while negotiations continued. Taking that deal wouldn’t have reduced the union’s ability to strike, and the Mediation Board isn’t releasing them now to do so in any case it seems.
Of course, even if the flight attendants union reaches a deal with American Airlines, we’ll have to see whether it’s one that they can sell to their members – after years of making promises about what they’d achieve which will likely far outstretch any actual agreement.
No strike until after election?
as expected, the NMB Is not ready to release the APFA to strike and AA is incrementally throwing just enough money to keep the process going and avoid an impasse.
thanks for the update, Gary
Time for a wildcat strike .
I’m an EP with AA and have contacted them directly and told them until they settle their contract with the flight attendants I’m done! I have now shifted to United. I spend roughly 250k a year on them and have always been treated kind by their flight attendants including my family. I know many as I fly mostly out of Charlotte. You have NO IDEA what these men and woman are up against. They have not had a raise in over five years! This would never happen in any industry, except the airlines. I hope they win and get everything they deserve. They work extremely hard, are understaffed and get no respect from their executive teams and deal with horrible passengers even in first class (I see it). I would never want to work for any airline in any capacity in the United States. Start treating your people right American! My father always said, money talks.
Gary: The really, really absurd thing here is that you are the best and most accurate source on this topic. The Star-Telegram had a recent article, but do you know whom they quoted as their most knowledgeable source? Yes, they quoted you.
Personally, I don’t see a strike (if any) before the election, but that’s just a political judgment, not a legal one. And, as you said already, it seems unlikely that AA would agree to something that would assure its own “Chapter 22” (that’s 2 x 11 for those who don’t get the joke) filing; that result, in turn, means a hard sell to the membership given, as you also said, what they’ve been promised. They’ve surely dug themselves into a hole, if that means anything. I’m not sure it does.
We’ll have to see what happens, of course. All we travelers can do is hope for the best, i.e., no strike.
Gary…it wasn’t the Spirit FAs on strike it was the pilots in 2010.
Let them strike so they can be replaced…..PLEASE!!!
And they can get rid of the caterers in PHL and CLT too.
It’s time to rebuild AA from the ground up.
I think the AFPA should be fired/folded due to repeated years of malpractice & negligence. Their own members don’t even seem to oay their dues (as evidenced by a lack of a meaningful strike fund and articles showing the AFPA begging for members to pay the dues they are “owed” in arrears). The average member is also ignorant of the facts and situation on the ground, as evidenced by the sig s and “talking points” they vomit out. The public is NOT on the side of FA’s too, due to years of lax swrvice standards and years of FA’s over reacting and going on power trips. I say fire the AFPA and start over or lock then out.
“…and to the President’s popularity,…”
I think he pretty much took care of that issue on Thursday night.
@John T “I’m an EP with AA and have contacted them directly and told them until they settle their contract with the flight attendants I’m done! I have now shifted to United.”
Please realize that United is also in protracted negotiations with their flight attendants. That contract became amendable in August 2021… about a year and a half later than American’s, but for all intents and purposes at the same time because of the depths of the pandemic. AFA-CWA has just been quieter at United, preferring to let American flight attendants ‘go first’ and possibly strike, so that whatever deal they get at American serves as a baseline for their own negotiations.
Correct me if I’m wrong (like I need to request that), but isn’t the “not had a raise in 5 years” statement technically incorrect. By this I mean the following. If I had X years seniority 5 years ago, I now have X+5. While the table determing pay hasn’t change, my pay rate today with X+5 is higher than with X five years ago.
None of this is a statement on what any new pay table should be.
The APFA should make more signs, pins, lanyards, and bag tags. Maybe really raise the stakes with another picket outside in the summer heat. That’ll show ‘em.
@Dave W – that’s fair, though it’s still true for everyone with 13 years of seniority on 1/2/19
In a free society, the possibility of a mass firing would be an option available to the employer and would help move the negotiations toward a settlement.
Sorry John T, but doubt you shifted all your flyting to UA, you would have to connect in one of UAs hubs and that would cost you time and money. I lived through many airlines strikes over the years at major hubs ( TWA / NWA) and stuck with them with minimal impact. There won’t be a strike and if there is it will be a day or two. I am more confident then ever a deal will be reached. The FA union has misguided their members for years, and in the end, that union leadership will be the ones looking for a new job.
Alert: a wildcat strike would give AA a really and valid reason to fire all AA FAs and replaced with those who want to work.
250k spend/yr. EP….lol
You might be right Gary that they don’t get an impasse declared, but I feel like it’s a pretty pre-emptive statement to make based on a very brief article posted by the union that has since been removed from their website…
If they get one declared next week, this article is going to look very silly.
@Andy – you can see this on their instagram here https://www.instagram.com/p/C82QIacRx2Q/?img_index=1
They also emailed this message out.
And I am not saying that they NEVER get an impasse declared. But clearly the National Mediation Board is not prepared to give them one at this point. As the union says, it’s back to the bargaining table – not strike – for now.
My point is simply, all the claims about an impasse being declared after Saturday’s meeting were clearly incorrect. The NMB did not do that. And the union’s previous claim that earlier negotiations were last ditch, the final ones, before being released were not correct.
Gary
Maybe you can enlighten me.
What was the downside off the FA accepting the unconditional 17% immediate raise offered by AA?
If nothing else it would have been the base for future raises.
For all of the sympathy that the entry level FA get for their poverty level pay of 27k the 17% raise would have put about 400 more in their pockets while negotiations continued.
Again what was the downside?
Was it the fact that this was not money that the union got them?
If so the FA are being grossly misrepresented by their union.
@Steven that was my argument. Capitalize the 17%, and negotiate up from there. In the meantime flight attendants get paid more. It was a strategic blunder, APFA was afraid that flight attendants wouldn’t feel so poor and wouldn’t be desperate enough to strike. The union wanted a fired up membership, and feared that if they let their members have partial raises now they wouldn’t be poor and motivated.
@Gary thanks for sharing the link to the insta. It is still a pretty vague post.
I just wouldn’t say the NMB is not ready to declare an impasse. It is not normal for them to demand a meeting on a weekend. I actually think they have set a date that they’ll declare an impasse if there’s no TA, otherwise there’s no need to give parties such late notice for out of business hours meetings.
Before crying too much about it, the idea that they haven’t had a raise in five years should be qualified. They haven’t had a raise in five years due to their own action of refusing a no strings attached 17% raise. Yes, they all could be enjoying more pay while negotiations continue. Much of the pain that the lowest paid Flight Attendants feel is due to their union.
The Spirit strike (I lived through it) was over with in a couple of days… they were being used by ALPA to make a national point that pilots can and would strike. They came back to work after the company overnight FedEx’d copies of its final proposal out to the pilots… which ALPA national team had declined to share with the membership.
Negotiations will continue. Shows how ineffective APFA is at getting the membership a raise. They shot for the stratosphere and didn’t budge. There’s gonna be a lot of budging by APFA. I see a card drive to AFA coming soon. What a shit show.. It’s sad that the union has failed so bad. They won’t be released. They will have to settle with will be their demise.
This has already been decided by congress. I’m a train dispatcher for BNSF. We voted to strike. We are under the RLA just like the flight attendants. Congress decided we got a 24% raise, back pay and an extra day off. (FAs should get boarding pay instead of the extra day). This has already been settled. I don’t know why this is even a question.
AA FAs received a 17% raise last month. The union just chose not to allow the higher pay to be added to employee paychecks. Am I wrong???
Chris
You would need NEW management to rebuild AA. They run things, they make the decisions. The current management is clueless just like you are. I cant imagine Isom will be around too much longer. PHL and CLT are the old USAir hubs, not AA. It takes 6 WEEKS to train a FA. That’s FAA regs. Plus the time it takes to hire. FAs aren’t hired off the street like at Walmart or McDonalds. Change caters? Lol. How many airline catering companies do you think are out there?? Unfortunately they are probably minimum wage and the same people working at Walmart. The FAs are just as frustrated with catering. We can’t do the service we would like when we don’t have what we need. It’s the customers that will suffer the longer we go with out a contract. We are the frontline and we worked and helped get AA thru covid. We put the negotiations aside. We were abused physically and violently by passengers. We lost 5 years of pay and thousands in retirement. Working 50% more to make ends meet. While Isom pays himself millions for failure. FAs are tired of being disrespected. I’ve haven’t seen this much solidarity in FAs since our strike in 1993. We are done and we have given enough.
David P. Yes you are wrong. We have received nothing. Isom wanted to give us the 17% just to placate us but no contract. So it would have just dragged on longer. Not very smart bc it would not of made things better. There are dozens and dozens of items and changes in the contract.
Pilot93434
We do not have to settle for anything and that’s why this still drags on.
JNS
To except One item out of a contract of dozens and dozens of items. Is ridiculous. Pay alone there are like 29 items negotiated. Why would anyone want to keep working with no improvements a contract from 2014?? Not to mention it could get dragged out another 5 years. Only small minded people would jump on a paltry few dollars compared to the total package.
Gary, Gary, Gary. You know nothing of what you speak.
FAs do not want to keep negotiating. The contract has dozens and dozens of items and changes. Pay alone there are like 29 different items. The union doesn’t have to “keep us fired up” because we are FED UP and we are SO ready to go on strike. We wait to hear from the Union everyday that we are released into the 30 day. We are getting fed up with everyone involved, AA, NMB. Who in their right mind would take a “bribe” just to placate when there is no good faith in bargaing with AA. They can drag this on for another 5 years. Do you really think it will some how magically make all FAs happy. Absolutely not, we would just get more frustrated having to keep dragging this on.
The contractual pay rates have not increased in years or since the last contract. The FA’s pay increases each year with the company. Since they do not serve meals and harass the customers, their value has decreased.
@Sphynx21
“FAs aren’t hired off the street…”
Where are they hired from then? NASA?
@CHRIS don’tcha know it’s harder to be an FA with AA than it is to get into Harvard? They are elite, like, the special forces of flight attendants.
@Sphynx21
The airlines can accelerate FA training to 3-4 weeks and minimize the service modules. AA got the employees thru Covid-not vice versa.
FA’s are hired off the street. Most have no college degrees or airline experience.
You were around for the 1993 strike so you should know AA prohibits employees from posting negative and denigrating comments on public websites. Perhaps, you are clueless and the company will terminate your employment.
You have a glorified, narcissist sense of self worth.
AA’s management is dragging on negations forever because they underperform the industry and they want the front line workers to subsidize their poor performance with their petty salaries. Ten years ago the front line workers gave up their retirement so AA could shore up its balance sheet and compete with the low cost carries. So what does AA’s management do? They spend 12.5 billion dollars buying back shares over a decade only to sink the share price from $50 to $11 . Do you think that is good investment ? They’re freeloaders. They don’t perform. They want to cash out, get bonuses and have labor pay for it. Since Don Carty’s misguided procurement of TWA which front line workers paid for, AA’s management has not made the grade. I think Warren Buffett would tell you when the tide goes out AA’s management team do not have their swim trunks on. They can only survive if labor subsides their underperformance.
Gary, thank you for keeping us updated.
I have AA flights during the first few weeks of July, but won’t make more AA reservations for the time being.
Firstly, looks like some people don’t know how unions work, to the guy that said let them strike and they will get fired….sorry bud, that can’t happen…that’s why we have a union.
Second your wrong on the reason for not taking the 17%, was not to make us feel poor bla bla bla….you can’t negotiate part of a contract like that, if we had taken that nothing else would of been settled.
I barely read your articles because quite frankly they are so my ex many incorrect information in them and it seems you really hate flight attendants…most of your articles are just very derogatory and offensive towards us. I just wish you would get your facts right, and whoever is leaking you information that you should not be divulging is truly a scab
Helpful update (as well as the clarifying information in the comments), thanks Gary !!!
You continue your bantering that the flight attendants union would have been better off to take the increase offered by American when you know exactly the reasons that would have been the worst thing the flight attendants could have done, as it has been pointed out to you clearly before in the comments if you truly didn’t get it prior to that. Now, the only way to take your continued postings is pure, dishonest company backed propaganda. Please stop! Nobody who has the facts agrees with you. Only the ignorant masses that you continue to stir up, and they have no say in it.
James
as others noted, Gary is not only accurate but one of the fastest and most accurate sources of information about AA labor and service issues. This isn’t anecdotal “the one bad passenger” or “I heard” kind of stuff.. this is confirmed policy stuff.
AA IS dragging out the process because the NMB only needs to see progress to keep the parties at the table, APFA made horrendously inflated asks for years, and AA can’t afford the terms APFA is seeking in part because AA FAs have destroyed the airline’s service. And arguing that AA doesn’t provide the tools so AA FAs are justified in treating passengers w/ contempt and hiding from passengers is not the company’s problem but only incentivizes many customers to favor a lockout.
It is doubtful that a settlement will change the toxic labor -mgmt relationship that has existed at AA for years and esp. since the USAirways merger which was based on AA foregoing its own plans in order to conform to what labor wanted.
The current path for AA is not sustainable. Someone needs to change the paradigm and the chances at this point are that the company is going to succeed at restructuring the relationship with the FAs than the other way around.
It went late into the evening last night too Gary !! You know nothing !!!!!!!!!
Negotiations Update #64
Talks Continue in Washington, D.C.
Negotiations between the APFA and AA went late into the evening yesterday at the offices of the National Mediation Board. Talks are ongoing as we continue the fight for the contract we deserve.
In Solidarity,
I do find it funny it seems to be the same folks here saying that the AA FA’s service is bad that say that all the FAs should be locked out and replaced and shouldn’t get a pay rise. What do you think AA did when hiring? Went around looking for the worst service individuals they could find? Then also who do you think is trying to become an FA at American only to be paid so little you’re on food stamps? The creme de la creme of hospitality service? The irrationality of your arguments is excruciating.
Someone earlier said AA can shorten the training time down to 3-4 weeks by removing service modules to try and replace the current FAs. While I’m not sure its true given I know at least one of the other majors does 6 weeks on safety alone, do you not see the irony in your ask? Everyone wants better service but your idea is to cut the service training? I’d also add the training facilities that these airlines have are designed to at best train ~500 or so FAs a month. Good luck training 27,000 in 30 days…
I would continue to point out that AA exists under the same marketplace stressors as the other big carriers. Same fuel costs, same landing fees, same catering costs, even that they all carry high (terribly unearned in Isom’s case) executive pay.
In fact, I would argue that Southwest and Delta handle even higher costs in that they are $30 per hour higher in top-end flight attendant pay.
So, what is the differentiator? My finger points to the ineptitude of current AA management (which looks like USAir with a different paint scheme)
And if the whole thing folds like a house of cards over treating staff equitably and with better working conditions (the impasse is not just over money, but also work rules and company regulations) – well then at least USAir already has their bankruptcy lawyer on speed dial.
Does anyone know if Robert Isom (AA CEO) was present at this past weekend negotiations? If not maybe he was out spending his $31,000,000.00 2023 income while some of his full time employees are still on food stamps. Isom needs to be replaced ASAP so American can return to the great airline it was before the arrival of the USAIR guys.
@Andy it’s a cultural issue. If I’m an FA and my coworkers slacking off and I’m not, well it’s only a matter of time till I start doing the same.
Lock them out? Now we suddenly have a bunch of new and motivated FAs who don’t resent their employers and WANT to do their jobs.
That’s the reasoning behind the team lock-out.
It’s not a coincidence that the best FAs (minus DL to keep Tim Dunn happy) don’t stay at their companies very long ala all the Asian or Middle Eastern airlines.
@A220 I mean there’s actually a great financial reason to lock these folks out and replace them, as you reset the cost base. A Capped out FA costs 2-2.5x what a junior FA costs. I agree culture is part of the problem, but tell me what the culture is when you have management not listening to you for 5 years. In the FA world, AA is well known to constantly break contract rules, to lie to junior FAs about their rights and to have large disparities in how they treat FAs vs other flight crew. A whole new batch of FAs may be motivated for a few months, but after living on $28,408 per year (their first year pay x the reserve guarantee of 78 hours – not including the deductions like having to pay for their uniforms) – while having to live in American hub cities of NYC, Chicago, LA, Miami, Dallas and DC (or commuting from another city and having to rely on available seats on planes and maybe having to pay a second rent in the hub you’re commuting to – i.e. a crash pad) – having management lie to you about your rights, sitting on 24 hour reserve constantly and facing being fired if you even so much as you turn up late, lose your badge or have a uniform infringement in your first 6 months, I don’t think they will stay motivated for very long.
But I do think we are discounting the selectivity of this process and treating FAs as if they are all equal and a job that can be done by anyone. Which is not the case, as evidence by the lengthy application and interview process these FAs have to go through plus the training which more than 50% fail. If this was a job that just anyone could do, then American would be stupid for investing so much in recruitment.
Most FAs at legacies started at a regional carrier first and then swapped so in fact most of the FAs at American have passed this hiring process twice. While the FA hiring process does look at things like customer service, they actually mainly focus on things like attention to detail, ability to respond quickly and ability to be flexible to different situations – I know this as my partner has been an FA (not at AA) for more than 5 years but has interviewed and received offers from multiple airlines.
The first piece of advice she gives to anyone who asks her how to become a flight attendant is to save money and that they will likely not be breaking even for their first 2-3 years as the pay is so low and the costs are so high, she says many first years quit because they just can’t afford to continue it.
Andy,
well said.
The notion that any airline’s employees do what they do because of one person is laughable.
DL simply engages with its people on as close to equal basis as possible.
FAs are not in the same market as pilots and APFA spent years making pilot-like demands which AA just ignored and waited them out. Now that retro is at stake, it is clear the APFA’s strategy cost AA FAs real money. Bad faith bargaining and setting unrealistic goals reflects on the union.
Yes, AA has done all they can to make the FA job miserable and AA FAs take it out on their customers. But you have to bet there is a point where AA mgmt has to believe it is worth a reset and just get rid of thousands of more senior AA employees who, as much as union activists want to believe otherwise, would only be too happy to swap with what DL employees have.
I expect AA to drag out the process of negotiating as long as they can but if the APFA strikes, AA suddenly moves on to a significantly different strategy.
It’s not even clear that UA would be willing to match DL’s pay plus retro so the notion that anyone gains anything by dragging this out is far-fetched.