The Points Guy ran a piece promoting continued mask-wearing after full vaccination, framed as a recommendation from “health professionals.”
What prompts this is the World Health Organization recommending continued mask-wearing after full vaccination. What no one seems to report is that the World Health Organization isn’t offering advice to the United States but to the world and often to countries that are relying on China’s Sinopharm or Sinovac vaccines which have lower levels of efficacy and likely much lower levels of reduction in spread. Chile, for instance, has continued to battle an epidemic despite vaccinating around two-thirds of its population (at least one dose, largely of the Coronavac vaccine).
The mRNA vaccines which represent the bulk of vaccinations in the U.S. have been reported by the CDC to be 90% effective against asymptomatic disease and likely even more effective than that against spread, since an asymptomatic vaccinated carrier will likely have a lower viral load, and shed virus for a shorter period of time.
It seems clear that the “Delta variant” of Covid-19 is more transmissible. And it’s going to cause clusters of cases in the U.S. focused largely on areas where vaccination rates are lower and especially where immunity from prior infection remains low. However at a population level it appears that the Pfizer-BioNTech and Moderna mRNA vaccines remain protective. And older Americans, most at risk from the virus, also have higher rates of vaccination. So we shouldn’t see the same kind of overwhelming risk to the medical system we saw in earlier waves of the pandemic.
Indeed, even in the U.K. where cases have gone back up – where they’re relying predominantly on the less-effective AstraZeneca vaccine – they’re still seeing significant protection against severe disease. Hospitalization hasn’t risen in tandem with cases, yet at least.
We know that masks do have some effectiveness against spread of Covid-19. The best work seems to show a 25% reduction in spread with near-universal mask adoption. However what we mean by masking does too much of the work, and wearing 5 cent apiece blue paper masks from Target or Amazon does little to protect the wearer or others.
Good masks, universally and properly worn, do provide some measure of protection. And I plan to personally mask up in close quarter indoor settings, and on planes, during flu season. This is protection that Americans vaccinated with Pfizer or Moderna do not appear to yet need from Covid-19, however.
TPG‘s sister health site makes this argument, and I don’t quite buy it,
“Mask wearing has proven to be an effective way to slow the spread,” Yu said.
“Vaccinations have allowed us to be together, but mask-wearing will continue to reduce the risks of variant spread and potential reversal of the openings. Knowing that this disease is mainly spread as aerosols, covering our mouth and nose is the most effective way [to reduce the spread].”
Mask wearing has been helpful especially where people wear decent masks and use them properly. There’s little risk of spread or severe disease once fully vaccinated, though some individuals may have lesser immune responses. Masks that are less-protective than N95s would be more protective of the wearer if the virus were spread primarily via respiratory droplets, rather than aerosols (cloth masks and thin paper masks aren’t going to help much with aerosols).
Oddly, the TPG piece ties continued mask-wearing for vaccinated individuals with “parts of Australia have gone into lockdown” which I’m truly perplexed by since Australia is pursuing a strategy of tamping down all outbreaks and eliminating community transmission, something the U.S. and most of the world that’s not an island nation isn’t in a position to follow. And most importantly because Australia flubbed its vaccine rollout. Very little prior infection in the population, combined with low vaccination rates, means nearly everyone remains vulnerable.
To be sure, there are reasons to still be concerned about Covid-19 even if a country has high penetration for an mRNA vaccine. For instance the rise in infections in Israel, even though the number of vaccinated people testing positive isn’t nearly as concerning as reports so far indicate.
Today the Wall Street Journal has the following alarming news. In the recent surge of cases in Israel involving the Delta variant, half of all newly infected adults had been fully vaccinated. I almost cried when I read that.https://t.co/2EaQMUHSa5
— Jeffrey Ely (@Jeffely) June 25, 2021
The mask mandate is no longer needed on planes. This would mean the end of most unruly passenger behavior on board and a return to inflight alcohol in coach, on American Airlines at least.
The media has hyperventilated on every variant.
You are 100% right Gary. Thank you for correcting the very irresponsible post from The Points Guy.
You’re a great travel blogger, but you’re not a scientist
Gary stick to points and miles, leave science and health to the professionals.
Stop denigrating China and spurring Sinophobia
Stop babbling about science
You know nothing about China or science apparently
Stick to credit card and travel points Gary. Seriously.
@iv – I’m citing the health professionals here. And I’m explaining how the science intersects with travel.
TPG has become part of the Mainstream Fake News Media.
Biden’s refusal to allow fully vaccinated US citizens carrying the CDC vaccination card to return to the US (unless they are first tested in a non-US country) undermines the push for vaccinations.
Why should Americans get vaccinated if our own country does not recognize its own document?
This confusing contradiction, along with the mask mandate, show that Biden does not trust US government approved vaccines. Instead, Biden trusts in masks made in China and non-US Covid tests.
In fact the AZ is estimated to be 92% effective against the Delta variant after two doses plus two weeks. The issue is that it is much less effective after only one dose.
Clearly the Delta variant will cause major problems for countries with low vaccination levels but, in the UK, where Delta is now predominant, it is causing very few hospitalisations and deaths. And, likely, much lower infection levels than being suggested as testing numbers have doubled – meaning that huge numbers of asymptomatic cases are being caught.
Back on masks, it makes no sense to say don’t bother with masks, but still keep the borders closed, unless Biden believes that vaccinations don’t work, contrary to what he says, and what the evidence suggests.
I quit reading TPG years ago and haven’t missed a thing about it.
The fact that he eliminated comments from the site is crazy. I know people can sometimes get off-topic, but a big company like TPG can have algorithms or hire moderators for things like that. Instead, no comment section leaves one with no ability to ask questions or add additional information to the post. Some of their articles are sloppy, incorrect, or out of date, and there’s no way of alerting readers without comments
Given that there is growing evidence that the Google helped fun gain of function research alongside what Fauci did with US taxpayer money and then Google has used its power to suppress competing views about the virus – including re: alternative treatment and vaccine information, it is absolutely imperative for voices like Gary’s to speak out.
It was clear from the beginning of the pandemic that there was money to be made because of tragedies in other peoples’ lives; it will become increasingly clear who benefitted and who lost financially in addition to loss and quality of life. People who aren’t willing to ask those questions are naive.
The US airline industry, which has received tens of billions of dollars of government aid, has fallen in line with government guidelines.
@JoeBeijing (Xi Jinping),
Gary’s website is “View From the Wing”, and he’s presenting his views regarding travel. He doesn’t need your approval or that of your Communist Party censors.
Gary is exercising his freedom of speech.
Here’s the problem. Recently I was in Coeur d’Alene ID, where there were signs everywhere that masks were only required indoors to the unvaccinated. NO ONE wore a mask. Considering that the vaccination rate at the time in Idaho was around 35%, that means that miraculously everyone who happened to be in CDA that day was vaccinated or two thirds of the people there didn’t think the rules applied to them. The choice is simple, either airlines police vaccine certificates, or masks will be required until herd immunity in the USA is reached.
Biden doesn’t care about herd immunity or vaccine efficacy. He is playing political theater by stating he will enforce his mask mandate until 9/11.
I fly every week and don’t mind wearing a mask on planes for the rest of eternity.
What I do object to, because I am fully vaccinated, is Biden’s knuckle-dragging Neanderthal refusal to accept official CDC documentation to allow fully vaccinated US citizens back into our own country, unless they are tested in a foreign country where it is impossible for the US to verify the accuracy of the tests.
@TM if you’ve got the vax who cares, you’re supposed to be protected, right? Everyone can make their own choices.
So you know more about epidemiology than the WHO.
Sure, Buddy. Sure.
When Biden returned from his trip to Europe, did he get quarantined on arrival in DC or perhaps got tested before stepping on a plane? Because if he did not he should go to jail ASAP!
No nothing “rules for thee but not for me”!
The important points is that there is no reason to believe that the drugstore and simple fabric masks commonly worn by Americans and most of the world have no proven efficacy with regard to the spread of Covid-19, full stop. N95/K95 masks seem to have some slight anecdotal efficacy (not rising to the statistically significant point of saying that slight efficacy is proven) against Covid infected wearers spreading infection to others, but there isn’t even anecdotal evidence to suggest it prevents uninfected wearers from becoming infected. Since vaccinated people cannot spread the virus, there is absolutely no point in them wearing a mask. Anybody who thinks vaccinated people should wear masks on planes or otherwise, is either ignorant of science, or simply not interested in science or health and engaging in politics and social engineering.
And while I’m here, let’s recognize the most ridiculous thing in the air today: the hospital gowns worn by Emirates Cabin Crew which is nothing more than very disturbing theatrics that makes flying on their planes the most unpleasant rides in the air today. I won’t be flying them again until this creepy nonsense is stopped.
@kenny so you obviously prefer to have Covid persist for months or even years more than necessary because some people care more about uncovering their faces and declining vaccinations than protecting their neighbors.
Preach on, Gary. You get it. Sadly, hide in his basement Biden and morons like Trudeau don’t have the balls to explain that eliminating the virus won’t happen and it will be endemic. Thus, we need to learn to live with it and stupid masks rules are not part of it.
Neither Biden, nor Harris, nor any of their attendees took Covid tests in foreign countries before returning to the US from their recent trips.
Neither Biden nor Harris wear masks the entire time they fly.
US government, corporate, and private flights are not subject to the mask mandate, so the Biden administration and his wealthy donors are exempt from the mask and testing mandates.
If my neighbors are concerned they’ll get the vaccine. To be hysterical about all things covid is a choice. It’s here to stay because it has proved to be a windfall for msm fear porn, big pharma, and government regulation. Imagine vaccinating billions of people with an entirely new class of vaccines that has zero long term safety data, and have not gone through complete FDA approval, only EUA. The majority of of people are at very low risk and don’t need this vaccine any more than a regular flu shot.
So we should do what is easiest and not what’s best? If there is a known problem, Delta variant and SEVERAL vaccines that are not as effective, why would we NOT keep wearing masks? Even in the US we have NOT reached a level of vaccination to provide herd immunity despite every state acting as if we have, and this is creating the opportunity for the variants to flourish here and abroad. Also, there is a significant portion of our population here in the US that won’t get vaccinated and will happily lie about it to be able to not wear a mask. The CDC recognizes this (among other reasons) and is saying- everyone wear a mask when traveling. So if you want to get mad or frustrated, point that ire at the folks that won’t get vaccinated and believe the virus is a hoax and are making lives harder for the rest of us and more dangerous for the vulnerable.
The FAA recommends (and most folks comply) to wear a seat belt in level flight based on the statistically small but still real chance of injury to myself and others due to clear air turbulence.
I will continue to rock my stylin’ set of face masks that I’ve accumulated for the same statistically small but real chance of injury to myself and others.
If I can put on underwear or shoes each morning, I can handle a mask, and so can everyone else.
@Lara S. Your views are driven by fear and not facts, much less an understanding of the relevant trade offs. The fact that the vaccines are allegedly not quite as effective against Delta doesn’t change the fact that they are still effective enough to prevent nearly all deaths and serious illness, and still offer plenty of protection against any and all infection. While it might not be 100%, there are many other everyday risks we accept in life that are no less dangerous. People might lie about being vaccinated, just like people have lied for decades about being infected with Tyhpoid, HIV, Syphilis, etc., etc., etc. But the happy news for worried people like you is that if YOU get vaccinated, you don’t really need to care about what anybody else does — they might get sick (or more likely have already been infected and developed innate immunity) but you won’t.
Of course, if this doesn’t satisfy you, it’s your right to stay home (despite the fact that the vast majority of Covid-19 infections were acquired at home and not in places like airplanes).
Biden definitely is not running for re-election and he most likely won’t make it through 2022. The establishment needed someone to push through 5 trillion+ In spending knowing the repercussions would be huge and damaging to whoever does it. What better person to do it than a barely conscious old man who has worked in Washington longer than most americans have been alive. Dumb Americans are just happy to not have a mean tweeter in office anymore. Biden doesn’t care what the repercussions are or his ability to get re-elected. More fear of Covid = more money printing so masks stay where the feds can mandate it (airlines, federal properties, etc). Joe doesn’t actually care about Kamala Heiress and the 2022 economic problems she will encounter and the dems just want to claim the first black woman president.
@Tom – no, I’m pointing out that WHO is speaking to the world where their advice is sound (vaccines in use in much of the world are far less effective than the mRNA vaccines which are the primary ones used in the US)
Covid is very serious. Death, brain fog, and many other things. Actually, the problem is not the mask mandate but that most people wear flimsy masks. N95 is better. Vaccination is great but people still die or get very sick from Covid. The vaccine doesn’t make all people bulletproof.
I don’t care what science or statistics you provide. The fact is the vaccine DOES NOT make you complete immune from the virus. As always, people could care less about the collateral damage (aka fellow humans) until it hits close to home.
A college baseball team had to drop out of the College World Series tournament last week because they didn’t have enough active players after many tested positive (the majority of them already had the vaccine).
The CRC has moved too fast with some of these decisions and it’s because of public pressure.
A mention of the return to in-flight alcohol shows how selfish and inconsiderate this country is. Again, giving in because of public pressure and removing the mask requirement would be ridiculous.
Regarding the quality of masks, they screwed this up at the beginning not communicating enough to the public about correct filters,etc. I was purchasing real 3m n95s from China that were on the US approval list and had mass production. Unfortunately, there’s no recovery at this point for the use of random masks but at least people have recognized that this isn’t over. Most people that want to stop wearing masks haven’t been affected at all. Covid hit my house when someone started getting that “I’m tired of this” mentality and started getting lazy.
I will take this seriously and will definitely argue if people can’t wait 4-8 hours to get off a flight to get some alcohol. That may be a sign that you have a problem
I am amazed at all the folks (that’s the currently approved word???) that put any trust in what the WHO or CDC have to say in this matter. The CDC had one job to do, and they blew it massively. They are more concerned with items that are outside their primary function, such as gun control and global warming–these issues give them the warm fuzzies inside that they are good people, but they are also issues that they cannot affect either way, and that makes them perfect for a do-nothig bureaucrat. Doing there real job is hard. These hacks may be credentialed, but they are not smart, and have succumbed to the corrupting influence of the large US and UN bureaucracies.
China is ruled by the CCP (Chinese Communist Party) so they bare alot of responsibility for the Pandemic and also poor vaccines, but the majority of Chinese people are not the CCP so I don’t blame them. Didn’t see them give free mask and other things to all of the world. Long run they may have made a bit of money and weaken their competitors.
On another note for those who are vaccinated, you can still only say the vaccines are like 90 to 95 percent effective for symptomatic, you could be the delta variant carrier and be
asymptomatic and giving it to everyone else.
The WHO and the CDC has a lot of politics involved in pushing the script. The smartest goes away when a politician is involved. At same time I believe many of the scientist out there are too trusting. They seem to think their colleagues are honest when they maybe not.
The incessant daily media bombardment of this “new” variant and that “new” strain has simply reached a point where the general public is beginning to just tune it all out. It will dissuade many from not taking the vaccine – given that no vaccine seems to help us return to normal. And what of the seasonal variants of the flu we see each winter? How many people will succumb to that virus?
It has reached the point of “enough is enough”.
I respect your views on travel, but your mask commentary is missing the point.
The article you reference (https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.06.16.21258817v1) for your 25% figure speaks to a 25% reduction in the R number.
If you look at this BBC article (https://www.bbc.com/news/health-52473523), particularly the graph, you will see that a 25% reduction in the R Number, say from 1.1 to 0.9 (yes, less than 25%) has a significant impact on reduction in spread. if we look ar reducing R from 1.1 to 0.9, the cases drop from 25,000 to approx 7,500.
I would suggest that this reinforces the need for masks, rather than the view that masks don’t do so much for us.
Just wear a f’king mask. Stop being seflish
@David Yang You owe me…errrr…for something. Venmo me immediately. Stop being selfish.
i always wear a mask when flying. before covid. i wore one and i will wear one once i start flying again.
Israel has the highest rate of vaccination. They now reinstalled the mask requirement because of breakthrough and deaths of some fully vaccinated people. Are you suggest that the Pfizer vaccines they used were actually Chinese vaccines?
@scientist – Israel is far from “highest rate of vaccination”. They hit a wall at 60% because of the orthodox.
Even UK and Canada have now vaccinated more with 1st does than Israel, and will surpass Israel in 2nd doses soon.
Gary, you are just trying to thread the needle to serve your own agenda. (In effect) ‘whatever you’re comfortable doing’ does not stop the spread. Particularly if the morons writing above are representative of the thoughtful American public?
The problem with your facts is that they are incomplete. Much we don’t know about this variant, but what we do know is alarming (like 10X more contagious, far more hospitalizations for <18).
By the time we find out it may be too late. But you're cool to gamble, just to get another free ride in a Q Suite?
I like your blog, but I find your take more than surprising. The selfishness and ignorance you read above is really pretty sad. Gary I think you are 100% wrong in direction on this one, and enabling the Don's and the Mak's and the Kenny's of the world to come out of their basement doesn't add a thing. Why would anyone with any common sense let the lowest common denominator set the standard for safety, in any situation …
Australia went into lockdown based on cases in the single digits in some states. Comparing that to the US or Europe is a false equivalency.
@MickC – I used this piece to argue that masks CAN BE effect, not to dismiss masks, I think you are misreading me
Another click bait drivel from a make believe epidemiologist. Sorry Gary you are not qualified to comment on this!
The Points Guy and his writers are people who just curl up in a fetal position and fear everything in life. I stopped reading their stuff on Covid months ago cause it was obvious they were going to take the side of mask forever for everyone. TPG also does not tolerate any difference of opinion either. I posted differing opinions on their Facebook page a couple of times and they were not accepted. I was not obscene or even rude but just offered a different opinion about mask.
I am vaccinated and I know I interact with people who are not vaccinated every day and they are not wearing mask either. I absolutely do not care. It is up to every person to decide for themselves. I am protected so you can do as you please. If I am willing to eat a meal across the table from someone who is not vaccinated what is the difference in getting on a plane with them?
Garry, please shut up. You’re a blogger on the internet, you’re not an epidemiologist nor have any medical training. The WHO has doctors, researchers and infinitly more knowledgeable experts than you investigating the virus and its mitgants. We shouldn’t take medical advice from our politicans, we shouldn’t take it from Karen on Facebook and adding to that, Garry from his little internet blog he sooks on.
You might hate wearing a mask, fine, the rest of us don’t want to get sick and want to rid the world of the virus in its deadly form. Go buy some timber, build a bridge and get over it.
100% agree with steve
If masks worked why did we experience surges?
So funny to watch the media just do anything they can to keep this going.
I was highly critical of the CDC early on but applaud them for following the science and sticking to it. So funny to watch people lose their mind when the science no longer aligns with their beliefs.
Gary, you’re easily one of the most sensible voices on this issue. Not just correlated with travel, but conversation-wide. Thank you.
Gary, you keep preaching about how we all have mRNA vaccines and are so very safe against COVID so don’t need masks on planes. I again ask you — what about those unfortunate people in the US who were given J&J? They told us to get the 1st vaccine available to us, and at the time it was J&J for me. J&J is less effective (66%??), and will be even less effective against the Delta variant. But who knows what J&J really is because no one seems to give a d*mn about it, no on runs tests on it, no one does comparisons on it, it’s the ugly problem child you hide in the closet. I’m sure J&J has no solution to their ineffective vaccine otherwise they’d be crowing about it. And maybe J&J have been doing tests on their vaccine with abysmal results, so they obviously aren’t motivated to talk about that. *there had been tests of mixing vaccines, but that was done by UK on mixing AZ & Pfizer (both 2 shot vaccines). Surprise surprise, mixing AZ with a superior vaccine like Pfizer gives excellent protection! Now they are going to expand to mix AZ and others like Moderna. But they don’t give a sh*t about J&J, because who’d want to mix their own vaccine with an inferior one? Even so, I’ve read that even Pfizer/Moderna is not effective against Delta if just 1 shot.
I talked to my doctor, and she said that the CDC/WHO have not recommended that J&J 1shot people get a 2nd Pfizer/other shot. Not even given the option. Duh, since no one gives a d*mn about J&J, no one is going to bother making any recommendations wrt to it. And my doc said that in the US, since I am already fully vaccinated (with J&J), I am not eligible to get the Pfizer shot in addition, unless the CDC gives new guidance. Or I have to lie and say I haven’t ever been vaccinated and get the Pfizer from a 3rd party (like CVS), but then my insurance will get the bill twice for vaccination and maybe they’ll make me pay for it.
I’m particularly irritated because I’ve been reading that some epidemiologists and doctors who were given J&J are getting a 2nd Pfizer for themselves because they know J&J is not effective against the Delta variant. Those docs might be urging the CDC to give guidance to give J&J people a 2nd shot, but the CDC has no incentive to admit their own stupidity by trying to push an inferior vaccine onto their public to get overall vaccination numbers up.
Sorry, rant off. I’m so angry because I am looking at an International flight to Asia, into a COVID hotspot, because of a family medical issue. Not sure what to do. How do you stay safe? Do you N95 mask for the entire 14hr flight and not eat or drink? I want to be as fully protected/safe as possible for myself and for my elderly unvaccinated relatives over in Asia. I don’t have the golden mRNA vaccine to fall back and relax on.
@Melody if it were *me* I’d go get another shot, say, 90 days after your J&J shot whether the CDC is recommending it or not. But that is merely what I would do personally and should not be construed as medical advice.
COVID won’t be the last coronavirus, or the last viral pandemic, of our lifetimes. Masks also help to shield us from other viruses (both seasonal and heightened influenza strains) by acting as both an air filter AND contact filter – from touching one’s face (how often does one do that without realizing it).
Science is science (says I, the lifelong scientist). Free-dumb is by choice. I choose the scientific method. Test, observe, validate, peer review.
For me, it will be mask-on in close-quarter public indoor spaces – and 100% while on public transport – from now on. Otherwise, let the tree and plant pollens have at me! LOL
Cheers!