4 Reasons Normal Travel Is Just Around The Corner

The novel coronavirus has cast a shadow on the whole world since January, though not everyone realized it until late February or early March. It’s led to a deeper recession than we’ve seen in any of our lifetimes, and one of the industries hit the absolute hardest has been travel.

Over the past several weeks there have been so-called ‘green shoots’ as domestic leisure travel has started to return in the U.S. For sure, travel isn’t rebounding as quickly as many have been saying and business travel is not coming back this year in any meaningful way.

The good news, though, is that we’re not that far away from a real recovery – in travel and for the world.

  1. COVID-19 patient outcomes are improving. We have better treatment protocols, perhaps the virus itself is becoming less deadly – that’s something to expect by the way, because viruses that infect the most are the ones that keep their hosts alive in order to spread. Maybe it’s just that we aren’t sending COVID patients into nursing homes anymore but even as cases remain at elevated levels the number of people dying from COVID-19 has been declining substantially in the U.S.

  2. Patient outcomes should get much better still this fall. We no longer have just remdesivir, and laying patients on their stomachs. Anti-inflammation drugs seem to be helping with patients in advanced stages of distress. There are clinical trials in process not just for repurposed antivirals, but also antibody-based drugs developed from the blood plasma of recovered patients. Hospital stays should become shorter with more people recovering more quickly.

  3. We can choose to limit the spread. We haven’t gotten there yet, cases plateaued in the U.S. but haven’t declined, however we know now that targeted interventions may be nearly as effective as total lockdowns. About 10% of people spread perhaps 80% of infections. We need to limit superspreader events which are virtually all indoors over prolonged periods. And we can wear masks.

    In Texas, where activity re-opened early and where just now we’re starting to see significant spread we have plenty of hospital beds though that can change quickly if spread grows exponentially (especially in Houston, and even in my home of Austin). Cities aren’t allowed to require people to wear masks (or at least cannot penalize them if they don’t) however given the situation on the ground the governor is now allowing cities to require businesses demand masks of employees and customers when in close proximity to each other, under threat of fine.

    Ultimately the fights over masks in the sky simply mirror those on the ground. Mask wearing has become political, although more broadly about lack of trust in institutions and authority – we were told not to buy or wear masks by the same people telling us now to wear them. They were wrong before, and the studies are overwhelmingly suggestive now that masks can make a big difference. But the credibility of the CDC and others is largely shot. Still, airlines are communicating seriousness and in what almost looked like a put up job American Airlines even banned a conservative activist flaunting their rules and videotaping it.

  4. There should be a widely available vaccine next year. This isn’t a guarantee, still speculative, but there are enough different platforms and enough different trials that we should wind up with something that is effective. The Chinese model of attenuated viruses may help only a little for a short period, but may be available first. Other approaches may take a little longer (mere months) but be more effective.

    I don’t expect a ‘one and done’ vaccine that protects you for years. And it may not be completely effective either. But if 50% of people take a vaccine that’s 50% effective, that along with the population that’s had the virus recently, and those who may have some cross-immunity from other viruses or natural immunity, should get us close enough to herd immunity that the virus isn’t particularly dangerous to those outside the highest risk groups.

In past economic downturns, cleaning protocols have been one of the first things to go at airlines. Planes would go as long as 18 months between deep cleans. This time the opposite is true.

Years ago, in the regulated era, the government worked to keep airfares high and shut down competition to make sure airlines earned consistent profits, believing that without those profits carriers might skimp on safety. That’s really not been true in the U.S., where airlines operated safely through myriad bankruptcies. Now not only are they safe, they’re clean too. And while some of the most extreme practices (like Delta spraying disinfectant between domestic flights) probably won’t last past the end of the pandemic, new clean is likely to remain in some form at airlines and hotels.

There will be some cost in terms of travel experience. We’ll lose investment in passenger and guest amenities as businesses work to rebuild their balance sheet before competing in that arena. But overall what we’re learning now is going to make travel better in the long tun.

About Gary Leff

Gary Leff is one of the foremost experts in the field of miles, points, and frequent business travel - a topic he has covered since 2002. Co-founder of frequent flyer community InsideFlyer.com, emcee of the Freddie Awards, and named one of the "World's Top Travel Experts" by Conde' Nast Traveler (2010-Present) Gary has been a guest on most major news media, profiled in several top print publications, and published broadly on the topic of consumer loyalty. More About Gary »

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  1. Gary,
    Can you point to your reference showing death rates declining

    We are not seeing this

    What we are seeing is that the stats look better because of testing changes

    Early on, as example, my system only tested suspicious people in the ICU.
    Half of them died
    So death rate was 25 deaths/50 positive tests or 50%

    Today: of those that hit the ICU half are still dying

    However my system now tests all symptomatic people, all pre-ops and hospital admissions, and as all people who were at recent protests

    We now have a few hundred positive tests per day, but luckily only 20 deaths per day due to social distancing which allowed our COVID Rates to drop

    So it looks like death rate is going down. But it’s really a sample bias

    We are getting better at treating this. Minimally
    The new antivirals and steroids show promise in moderately ill people. Not so much for severely ill people.

    Todd above is beyond misinformed
    Doctors would do anything to find a treatment that works, since we are the ones most exposed to this deadly disease

    The drug companies would love it too
    Imagine if there was a quick and easy treatment for COVID
    It would make TRILLIONS of dollars around the world.
    With no research and development

    We would love if hydroxychloriquine and azithromycin worked.
    But they don’t
    And they increase cardiac arrhythmia and sudden death.
    So they had to be abandoned.

    The bell weather will be this Fall
    If ICUs become over run again, you will see a lock down on travel

  2. @Gary you are unfortunately completely wrong about your home state of Texas.

    Australia and New Zealand have a combined population of 30 million, are more reliant upon air travel than Texas, and have had a combined total of 124 deaths even though the virus arrived here before it arrived in Texas.

    Texas has a similar but smaller population – 29 million – is less reliant upon aviation, does not have direct flights from Wuhan like we did and got the virus later. But you have had 2105 deaths.

    In other words, 94% of the deaths in Texas were unnecessary and preventable.

    And Texans are 17 times more likely to be killed by Coronavirus than Australians or New Zealander.

    This is not a line ball decision. Your failure to shut down international travel has made your outcomes 17 times worse than ours. And yet you talk about increasing travel! It’s staggering.

  3. @DavidF – you’ve completely changed your argument and now you’re off-point. You said that lower death rates now are because the vulnerable had already died. I said that in much of the U.S., experiencing lower death rates than earlier outbreaks, the experience with significant spread of the virus is new. The vulnerable largely hadn’t died yet.

    Your claim that “Your failure to shut down international travel has made your outcomes 17 times worse than ours” is not quite right, here’s why our travel bans failed https://viewfromthewing.com/why-the-china-travel-ban-failed-and-the-virus-spread/ basically the Europe ban came too late (fair!) but the China ban was early enough… it just was poorly implemented, it wasn’t the lack of a ban it was that our bureaucracy failed us in implementing one. A travel ban at this point does nothing whatsoever for the U.S. https://viewfromthewing.com/its-time-to-lift-travel-restrictions-on-china-and-europe/

  4. @Gary,
    Respectfully, I don’t defer to anyone else on the issue of travel bans.

    It’s NEVER too late. All viruses will eventually fizzle out – look at London and NY/NJ. The problem is, as long as you have international travel you import and export the virus and cause new deaths. It could be your loved one killed by a person who imported the virus from London tomorrow.

    I suggest that you follow the NZ media closely. Their news stories about their cases illustrate it perfectly: after wiping out the virus they have (safely, thanks to policed hotel quarantine) this week imported two cases each from the UK and India as well as one from Pakistan. They literally know precisely where every potential new case is before the person is even tested.

    The US has yet to reverse any of its major blunders.

    1. Inadequate testing (per capita).
    2. Inadequate contact tracing.
    3. Inadequate border and flight closures.
    4. Failure to introduce mandatory policed quarantine for returning travelers.

    These are just updated versions of the centuries old ways of controlling pandemics. And in the absence of a vaccine or any proper treatment, they are more important than ever.

    It’s still not too late for Failed States in Coronavirus terms to wake up and reverse their mistakes.

    Our dear friends the Americans taught us how to manage this 100 years ago with Spanish Flu. And what your grandparents taught our grandparents still works 100 years later. We just wish that you’d follow your own grandparents’ wisdom rather than starting to declare victory and open up before there is either a treatment or a vaccine.

  5. As I had mentioned previously, everyday people who want to travel are never going to do the constant examination of ongoing research that has been presented in this article. Just look at the push back in comments that those of us who do follow travel websites have demonstrated.

    The effect of media soundbites are what reach the ordinary Joe when it comes to travel and covid. No mistake about that. Additionally there is no consensus as to what approach will be most effective, both in short and long term among the so-called experts. What is the layperson to believe when planning future travel. It’s truly a mess and a damn shame.

  6. Hi Gary
    As a doctor, i am not sure that i agree with your comments and views on this post which unfortunately create a false picture and false sense of hope concerning the future of travel. Just because the death rates associated with COVID-19 have been declining does not mean anything. At the rate our country is prematurely opening up, and given that many people are not taking COVID-19 seriously by refusing to wear masks in public (I see many of them walking around including all those people on TV during the recent protests), this trend may sadly not continue. Mask wearing in public which is a strong medical recommendation has become very politicized. Never in my 35 years of practice have I seen medicine placed in a position of being subservient to politics. Total stupidity, ignorance and idiocy if you ask me. We need to wait till the fall to decide what happens to travel. Based on what the infectious diseases experts are telling us, there is a high likelihood that we will end up up with a surge in COVID-19 cases and our hospital ICUs are very likely to become flooded with COVID-19 patients all over again. In fact, this is already happening in some states and the governors of those respective states are being foolish by not doing anything about it. As far as returning to “normal” travel is concerned, I am not so sure about that. It all depends on what you mean by “normal”. I do not think that we will ever return to travel the way it used to be. Vaccines are all iffy at this stage. It takes time to develop a vaccine and I am not sure that we will have one by the end of the year as some people are saying. To that I say show me the money. The crux of our problem I believe is our society. Too many people refusing to go along with the very wise medical recommendations concerning masks in public and social distancing. Look at New Zealand. They have no more reported COVID-19 cases. If our citizens in the US acted like those in New Zealand and not rebelled against the medical recommendations (due to bogus politics) we too would have been able to stamp out COVID-19 in our country. So, given all the above, I am sorry to say that “normal” travel is far away and there is a likelihood that it may never happen. Respectfully.

  7. @Shaul M. Saddick – you are absolutely right that trends could reverse themselves, but I think I offer reasons to believe at least that case fatality rates will improve further. I absolutely agree with you on the benefit of mask wearing and note its importance in this post. Note that I do not suggest we’ll have a vaccine *by the end of the year* but I do think there’s a good chance, albeit still speculative, that we’ll have one in 2021. And we don’t need the vaccine to be 100% effective to really limit spread.

  8. JRMW says:
    We would love if hydroxychloriquine and azithromycin worked.
    But they don’t.

    Where did you read they don’t work, JRMW? Please don’t quote that recent study from Lancet/NEJM that was retracted as it was from a science fiction author and an adult content model. It does work but doesn’t make any money for vaccine companies so FDA removed it under pressure of said companies. Take a look at the video I posted containing facts and perhaps you will have a change of opinion.

    Generally speaking, people are caught up in the narrative from their authority figures. Until they break away and start questioning the narrative that is all they will believe.

    Charlie says his authority is Dr Fauci. Sorry Charlie but you have no idea who this fellow is. Have you investigated his background?? Have you done one ounce of research of someone you follow? You can start here. The rest is up to you. https://childrenshealthdefense.org/news/fauci-steering-the-pandemic-narrative-toward-vaccine-solutions-is-nothing-new/

    I’m generalizing here but doctors in the US, especially in the ER and ICU, don’t practice medicine anymore. They practice protocols. Meaning, they are not allowed to use their training to observe what is going on with a patient. They dare not speak out against the protocols for fear of demotion or being fired. So many knew ventilators were not the way to go. Yet, they ended up killing many and injuring others for the rest of their lives.

    If this was such a deadly virus there should be a lot more people dead. Yet for months now I’ve seen people all over the US, in my home area and around the world without masks on…talking face to face with people. Young, old, whatever they are still alive today. I’m not saying it is not dangerous. I’ve had friends debilitated for weeks with it. But they recovered fine. One with Vit D and C, the other in the hospital but out in three days after HCQ/Z-Pak/Zinc.

    Was at a few outdoor markets today. Almost 90 and humid. People wearing masks but others not. You have to be a total follower to believe that mask will do good vs the harm it will do, especially to the older population. Breathing out their carbon dioxide and whatever else coming out of from their bodies and whatever attaching to it from others. Half of them not putting it on properly after which taking it off, rubbing their hands all over it and touch all kind of things that other people touch. Yeah…that’s a good idea!

    I’m sure there will be a number of volunteers ready to stick out their arms for some injectable poison. Go right ahead. Get some.

    (Gary – thanks for doing excellent work over the years for all things travel.

    Lastly…..

    The four companies that produce all 72 vaccines mandated for American children (forced vaccines coming very soon to an adult near you)….every one of them is a convicted felon. Since 2009, those four companies collectively have paid $35 billion in criminal penalties and damages and fines for:
    • defrauding regulators,
    • falsifying science,
    • bribing doctors and POLITICIANS,
    • lying to the public, and
    • for killing lots and lots of people.
    Take Vioxx alone. Merck knew that it would cause heart attack, but sold it as a headache pill. They didn’t tell the people, “You won’t have a headache, but you might have a heart attack.” Of course, if they told them that, not too many people would have bought it. So, they decided to keep it a secret and they killed 120,000 people minimum, probably closer to 500,000 people.
    What kind of cognitive dissonance does it require to understand that this company is lying and cheating and killing with every other medical product and pharmaceutical product that it makes, but it has found Jesus when it comes to vaccines, and it’s not going to lie about that?”
    — Robert F. Kennedy, Jr, Director of Children’s Health Defense, at the New York Rally & Lobbying Day for Vaccine Injury/Vaccine Rights (5/14/19)

    Over $4 billion has been paid out to families for injuries due to vaccines. These monies are paid by you the consumer from a $0.75 tax assessed on every vaccine sold in the US. So, not only do these 4 companies have legal immunity, they don’t have to pay out for injuries. When are you going to start fighting back?

    One more thing…..the CDC has never run the numbers in their VAERS database of the vaccinated vs unvaccinated children. If vaccines were so effective don’t you think they would do that study? They have been petitioned over and over but refuse. They can crunch that out in 72 hours as they have all the history. They refuse. Yet, some recent studies by independent groups all over the world show unvaccinated children are much healthier. Think about that! Because mandatory vaccines are coming for the adults sooner than you think! And…that’s the ultimate purpose of all this. To get the adults. Because kids only bring billions to the vax industry. Adults will bring the trillions.

  9. Shaul M. Saddick — I know you think your opinion matters more because you are a doctor, but you are wrong. The medical community, and our science community in general, has completely failed us during this COVID crisis. The science has been horrific, and mostly wrong. Honestly, the only people who have been helpful are the ones who can run data, and you don’t need to be a scientist to do that. Hopefully, some bright scientists come up with a vaccine soon and save your profession from permanent credibility damage.
    As far as travel rebounding, we’ve seen some progress, but because the science is so bad, we really don’t know what will happen next. Right now we have a completely unexplained situation where the hardest hit Northern states are steadily and consistently getting rid of the virus, but the Southern states seem to be get slammed with new cases. Oddly, however, the new cases are mostly young and the death count is actually trending lower in these states. It’s very strange and, as has been the case, the scientists have no idea why. Hopefully, the death counts continue to decline and travel continues to rebound, but uncertainty is not good for travel.

  10. I find your comments in response to my post to be amusing. Putting down the medical profession and community when that very community has done nothing but try and protect and save the lives of non-infected individuals and COVID19 patients during this pandemic is being ungrateful and disrespectful. In case you have not already heard, there are many healthcare professionals who got infected with SARS-CoV-2 while attending to COVID19 patients. Some have died in the process. Maybe you would much prefer to have your so called non-medically trained data crunching personnel / data analysts care for the dying COVID19 patients in the overwhelmed emergency rooms and ICUs across the country? Would you want these non-medical data analysts working on you or your relatives if you contracted COVID19? Your comments tell me that you know very little about this very destructive and lethal virus. I do not blame you for that as there are many who have still not comprehended the severity and the lethality of SARS-CoV-2.. I highly recommend that you spend some time learning about this virus and how it is transmitted. You may also want to take some time learning about how it affects previously healthy children and adults. I am talking about strokes, thrombosis, embolism, unexplained clotting of blood etc etc. You may also want to learn about the long term medical effects of contracting COVID19, These effects are shown to cause long term disability and impairment in some patients. A lot of so called recovered COVID19 patients are not fully recovering. As a member of the medical community there is nothing that we need to be ashamed of which is what you are implying. As a doctor I stand proudly by my fellow physicians and scientists who have been nothing but truthful, altruistic, and forthcoming about this pandemic from day one continuing , very much in contrast to what some of our ignorant politicians have been doing. The models used to predict deaths and infection rates have had their faults and no one is denying that. You need to know that disease transmission models are not perfect and are influenced by the assumptions and rules that are programmed into them. To blame and ridicule the entire medical profession over this is being naive about how these models operate. SARS-CoV-2 is a relatively new virus and there was little known about it and its behavior initially. We are learning more and more about it each day. No matter how faulty a model, I would rather enter the virus war zone with some type of model (plan) as opposed to no model at all. You are of the opinion that travel is returning to normal soon. I do not see how. With people running around unmasked and failing/refusing to maintain social distancing, we will most definitely be seeing an increase in the number of infections and COVID19 related deaths in the near future. You want to tell me that air travel is somehow going to be spared and none of these infected people are going to get on board a flight and spread this virus? I do not see how this is going to happen. You can choose to live in denial. That is your option.

  11. http://www.askdrbuttar.com/facemask/
    Oh my, “how it affects previously healthy children and adults. I am talking about strokes, thrombosis, embolism, unexplained clotting of blood etc”. If you are stating that CV is responsible for this than you don’t understand the immune system.

    By the way, SIDS rate is DOWN since March as babies don’t visit their doctors for their regular poison injections. Aren’t they lucky!

    Bring back the old country doctors who used their training in conjunction with observation and feel.

    Look at the many reports of a correlation between CV deaths worldwide with low vitamin D levels (under 40). Many extremely low.

    Medical errors are the third-leading cause of death after heart disease and cancer. Look it up!

  12. @Todd
    As an anti-vaxxer, I’m sure you won’t care
    But you asked for my source about hydroxychloroquine so here it is
    The FDA

    If note, my institution is using hydroxychloriquine and azithromycin
    They did nothing and led to acute cardiac events
    We keep having to stop the meds due to arrhythmias
    We are also using remsdesivir and steroids

    https://www.fda.gov/drugs/drug-safety-and-availability/fda-cautions-against-use-hydroxychloroquine-or-chloroquine-covid-19-outside-hospital-setting-or

    Again:
    Doctors and nurses are getting Covid and dying
    We get $0 from big pharmaceutical companies
    Why do we give a flying f@k about what pharma wants?
    Why do we give a crap about what Trump or Biden want?
    Answer: we don’t

    I’m not dying so that Pfizer makes trillions and I’m certainly not gonna die to “defeat Trump”

    We would use these meds if they worked
    The US stockpiled millions of doses of hydroxychloriquine
    Useless unless you have malaria or gout

  13. @JRMW

    On the contrary….I do care but I open my eyes to other possibilities. Not just one narrative. You have got to be joking abut the FDA. Completely corrupt. I won’t even start with that. Did you even watch the video I provided that looks at the facts, the studies, the success of others using HCQ?? Love to hear your comments afterwards.

    You want to know why your doctors and nurses are getting sick?? Go pull their Vitamin D records. I would guarantee most of them are below 40. More likely in their 20’s. They are inside all day, exhausted, overworked and surrounded by all kinds of contaminants. Their Vit C levels are low and they don’t take any balanced Zinc. Add that up, throw in a horrible diet with extreme stress….yeah… first responders first to go.

    Doctors make horrible patients. I had to nurse a good doctor friend of mine to recovery from CV back in April. He spent 10 days in bad shape at home before I found out. Asked him about his Vit D level, which he took in January was 27! I immediately sent him D3/K2, 22mg Lipo Vit C per lb body weight (4 grams+ daily), balanced Zinc with Copper and in a few days he is better. Now 100% to normal and still doing the above with a cut in the C and getting out in the sun for D. (not medical advice)

    I’m not going to get into discussion about Pharma and their influence in hospitals. Not relevant here other to say it is all about business. Pharma wants people sick or they don’t make money. It’s a horrible thing for me to say but I”m not the first. It is all about money.

    As a doctor you should question why the Pharma/vaccine industry can’t be held liable. Why they don’t do double blind saline placebo tests. Every other drug is fully tested with placebos. Except vaccines. Why??

    Happy Fathers Day to all the dads. Make a pledge to take care of your immune system…today. Go out in the sun for 20 minutes a day without sunscreen, except between noon to 3. Go boost your T Cells and forget about antibodies. Eat better and get some exercise. Turn off the TV! And, watch the below video and other non-mainstream reports to balance your thinking.

    https://youtu.be/Ft4bVtcQcGM

  14. Your article is daring and full of wishful promises!
    Every case is a case and we are still recognising different terrains.
    And to say that we’ll have a vaccine later this year or maybe next year is absolute nonsense ! Nobody knows! Just remember that we have been searching one for HIV/Aids for the past fourty years. Still not in sight!

  15. In response to my colleague in Australia David F I could not agree with you more We have it all wrong in the US. We have managed to make many mistakes in handling SARS-CoV2 and still have not learned from our mistakes Reopening the country without following the necessary steps to reduce chances of spread is foolish Hardly any contact tracing aggravates matters even more

    I respect how the matter was handled in Oz and NZ I have many relatives in Oz some who are doctors. We have frequently chatted about this topic. There is no question that the Australians and New Zealanders have done this right

    In response to Todd. Yes I know my immunology quite well like the back of my hand. Do you? You can sit here and quote Dr R Buttar to me till you turn blue in the face. Sorry not impressed. His views are esoteric and not espoused by the scientists in main stream medicine. Your statements regarding vitamin E are nit supported by the data. Yes vitamins can be helpful but are not a cure for COvID Lots of anecdotal data. Not good enough

    Hydroxychloroquine
    does not work. Major side effects I know a couple of people who are taking it as they are sold on it. Not me But if you believe in it you are free to use it Just be mindful that causes cardiac arrhythmia

    You say something about that if this virus was truly lethal more people would have died. Really? Do you consider over 466k deaths worldwide not a big deal ?

    As far as face masks are concerned you are free to wear one or not. It’s your life. But please be respectful when around the rest of us or other people as exposing us to potential infection would be unethical and selfish. I have no problem with people not wearing masks as long as they are respectful and mindful when around others. It’s not fair that you would expose others to danger by not wearing a mask when in public

    Below is a link to an article which recently appeared in JAMA Internal Medicine addressing the efficacy of face masks, eye covering and social distancing. In COVID

    Happy Father’s Day to all. Wishing everyone good health and happiness. Thank you

    https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(20)31142-9/fulltext

  16. Sorry – the link I posted above to the article on face masks, social distancing and face shields appears in The Lancet and not JAMA Internal Medicine. Thank you. Be well.

  17. The back and forth on this topic has turned into a round table discussion of who’s data summaries carry more weight than anyone else. The discord that has surfaced because of the increasing frustration we all feel and all share is there for all to see. This resolves nothing nor should it be able to. It amounts to no more than blowing off steam – that can be a good thing.

    We can only hope that the powers in charge come to adopt the truism from the great economist from the Hoover Institution at Stanford University, Thomas Sowell, when he said, ” In all human efforts their are no solutions – only trade offs”. Simple but so true.

  18. Luis – I completely disagree with you which is exactly one of the problems. Meaning, there is no open, live national TV debate with doctors, scientist, vaccine makers, fda, cdc, who, etc.. presenting both points of view. Which would allow for the public to hear facts that they never heard before, LIVE and unedited. Independent fact checkers to look over submitted evidence. Would be wonderful but don’t ever expect this will happen until, sorry to say, a lot more people rise up and ask questions as they lose a love one.

    The closest thing we have to the above is when Dr. Stanley Plotkin, often considered the father of vaccines, was grilled on the witness stand for hours in 2018. The outcome wasn’t so good for him.

    @ Shaul

    So in your world do you believe antibodies are useful for Covid19? Or perhaps it is T cells? I never mentioned Vit E. Do you even know your vitamins? E is useless for CV. D3/K2 on the other hand is extremely important and necessary to help stimulation of T cells. By the way, there are a lot of medical papers on D supporting its use for CV. You never answered if you watched the video about HCQ that I posted which submits facts completely against the recent studies that denounced it. You can’t dispute that as the facts are clear. I and many other scientist and doctors do not believe 466K deaths were directly caused by CV. Which all circles back to Luis and his statement.

    If anyone who may be reading these posts have any connections to mainstream media and can make a debate happen, with one phone call I will have enough professionals to go against anyone from Shaul’s main stream medicine side.

    Lastly, Dr Rodrigues Pereira is absolutely correct. There will be no vaccine for the masses this year and perhaps never. They will not work for CV just like they don’t work for the common cold. not that I am saying this is like a cold. On the contrary, it is far worse due to its origin. But that is a different story. Dr. Paul Offit and Dr. Peter Hotez, (often on mainstream media) who we have come up against in the past had something very interesting and good to say recently. Which was, basically there will be no licensed vaccine until at best 2021 3rd quarter. Any release before that is dangerous. The only way it gets out soon is if Trump orders it to boost his election. That will be very very sad if first responders sacrifice themselves to try it.

  19. Someone named Angela posted this on social media….
    Do you ever just look back at the last 4 months and scratch your head? Like, how in the f*k did they convince the world to social distance, mask up, have no funerals, forcibly homeschool (while still taxing us for public education), stay in our homes, forfeit incomes and personal businesses, snitch on our friends and neighbors, hug grandparents thru plastic, race bait us, & thoroughly have us on the verge of civil war with each other…
    All to turn around and tell us that most of that is nixed and completely negated if we want to protest, riot, and loot the businesses already on the brink of bankruptcy, destroy our cities, defund our police, set everything on fire, and all the while, we’re allegedly at tremendous risk of a deadly virus that can be diagnosed without official testing- and even tho it’s super “dangerous” things that keep us healthy (health food/supplement shops, gyms/health facilities, chiropractic centers, many health services/elective medicine, and naturopathic health centers, outdoor activities and parks) are taken away, but cigarette/alcohol, and fast food were deemed “essential”…
    WTF world are we living in, and how come so many are complying?

  20. Todd:

    I meant Vitamin D not E. It was a typo. I could not find the video you reference in your reply to me. I will be happy to look at it if i can find it. Maybe you can re-post the video? I am aware of and familiar with the studies done on Vitamin D and death rates in COVID. Take care.

  21. Shaul –

    Here is the video about HCQ scandal.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FBI_pobBfck

    Here is the video on T cells.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ft4bVtcQcGM&t=251s

    This one on Vit. D, which dives into racial disparities with COVID-19 & Vitamin D. Lots of statistics here. This video takes a more balanced view by throwing in a few studies saying too much D could be a problem. Which is a bit ridiculous as D in high doses has been used for many years without trouble. Interesting to read the hundreds of comments at the end.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bDt6ca2WF3Y

    My basic point overall is for doctors to stay open to other narratives coming from your own peers. Naturally you will have quacks on both sides but discounting those, if there are two narratives coming from both points of view doesn’t logic demand that a debate should take place? Isn’t it totally unfair for mainstream to blast just one side? People don’t research. They believe in their authoritative figure and that’s it. They don’t question. History has shown that has not been the best road to take. Question everything when it comes to life/death.

    Todd

  22. Todd

    Thank you for posting the three videos you mentioned in your earlier post. I went ahead and downloaded them. Will review them later on tonight and tomorrow when I have some time.

    I concur with you. We all need to be open to other narratives and alternate views of addressing COVID-19 and all diseases versus digging in and sticking to one point of view. You have a good point. I have been reviewing some of the literature on Vitamin D and COVID since your post and I have to admit that some of the findings are impressive. I had a cousin who was a practicing nephrologist for many years. He was really big on using vitamins and other supplements in treatment of certain kidney disorders. I remember our phone conversations about vitamins and other supplements in relation to immunity. This was many years ago. I can honestly say that he was one of the very early pioneers in this area. I can recall some of his colleagues downplaying the whole idea of using supplements in treatment of disease. Unfortunately, he passed away five years ago and took all that knowledge and experience with him. Anyway, thank you for your input. I will most certainly review everything that you have placed on this post. Take care. Be well. Sincerely, Shaul

  23. Shaul –

    Appreciate you taking the time to watch the videos. Interested in hearing your thoughts, even if you completely disagree. It opens up discussion.

    Best,
    Todd

  24. I stand by my former comments and I have no further/ongoing interest to review literature concerning vitamin supplements, vaccines, trials of this and that possible treatment. It would amount to nothing more than an intellectual exercise for me in the forum becoming “gotcha” commentary. I leave the heavy lifting to the “experts”.

    I am neither a scientist or physician or person who can make the big decisions for the rest of society. I merely am a self-interested observer who is enjoying retirement and looking forward to my 21st trip to Hawaii with my wife as soon as possible. Nothing more.

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