Delta CEO Ed Bastian as an op-ed in the Washington Post advocating for a federal No Fly List for ill-behaved passengers. What’s striking about the piece is how dismissive it seems to civil liberties concerns and the rule of law, and how little self-awareness there is over steps Delta itself has failed to take to address the problems their crew face in the air. The No Fly List probably won’t make much difference in any case.
Delta Advocates Lawless No Fly List, Rather Than Harsher Penalties Provided By Law
Delta can add passengers to their own No Fly List, and those who behave badly on Delta won’t be a risk to their own employees again. But that may not be a deterrent. The risk to the passenger needs to be greater, in Bastian’s model.
Already the Department of Justice is prioritizing cases, which may not be appropriate when violent crimes overall are on the rise and federal prosecutors deal with risks that affect society at large – terrorists, mafia dons, and … mask-noncompliers. But they are doing this.
Congress could pass laws with stiffer penalties, meted out by courts, with proper judicial review – respecting rule of law. But that’s not what Bastian is asking for. Instead he wants a no fly list which is a lawless mechanism instituted by the Executive which routes around Congress and lacks judicial accountability.
Bastiat says, “Holding individuals accountable for criminal behavior shouldn’t be a controversial or partisan issue.” And it’s not – there are criminal statutes that lay out penalties. But nowhere in the piece is there an argument for amending those statutes. Instead there’s a call for a No Fly List.
People get on No Fly Lists by mistake, when an official checks the wrong box on a form. They get on as retribution for failing to snitch when a federal agent insists on it. They could be placed on when a flight attendant accuses a passenger of something wrongly, and other crew back them up out of solidarity, or when a crewmember acts badly and makes an accusation pre-emptively. Even if these are rare they can happen and without transparency and judicial review Americans can have their right to travel curtailed.
To be sure, courts haven’t found a specific right to travel by air but they have very much found a right to travel – and a national No Fly List which prevents someone from traveling by air from New York to Hawaii substantially burdens their right to travel.
To be sure, Bastian promises:
Travelers convicted of violating the law would have the opportunity for due process. And we support a process that allows offenders to have their inclusion on the list reviewed and removed if warranted.
However that’s not how administrative no fly lists work, and Delta has never publicly advocated to change that. This strikes me more as almost a throwaway line meant to dismiss civil liberties objections, rather than to take them seriously.
Delta Fails To Take Action On Its Own, Preferring Government Subsidies
It’s always striking how little consequence there is for passengers who cause costly diversions, which interrupt n airline’s schedule, incur additional fuel and crew expenses, and inconvenience other passengers (both on the same flight, and those flying the same aircraft later in the day). Meetings and family events get missed, people remain uncomfortable, and connecting itineraries get ruined.
Delta, like other airlines, rarely pursue the passenger that’s at fault for these costs. They could sue passengers responsible. Often those passengers may be judgment proof, but even the process of being sued by a major corporation is itself a form of punishment.
While the airline applauds prioritized prosecutions, they do not themselves prosecute cases civilly raising the cost to bad behavior. Instead they prefer to have the federal government pick up the litigation tab and also take any reputational risk so they aren’t seen ‘going after’ someone who may ultimately generate sympathy when being pursued by a corporation. They’re making the case for subsidy.
It’s Often Substance Abuse Or Mental Health Challenges, And A No Fly List Won’t Help
We’re seeing more onboard incidents in part due to mask mandates (the government has reported that these incidents overwhelm all others). That mandate likely goes away in a few months, making the No Fly List moot for these.
But we’re also seeing more incidents fueled by substances and mental health challenges. Perhaps that’s a function of who’s been flying during the pandemic. Perhaps there really are, statistically, more people with these issues and that finds itself onto a metal tube.
Regardless, when mental health, alcohol, or drugs are the issue a rational calculation of risk versus reward to behaving badly on board likely isn’t decisive, in which case the national No Fly List wouldn’t have much effect and amounts to grandstanding.
Always ill advised when those without a legal qualification throw legal terms around in an imprecise manner. It is sufficient to say that the separation of powers works well and that each branch of the Government, Executive, Legislative and Judicial is needed for it to work.
I agree with the sentiment that trying to achieve things by secret deals behind closed doors is not the way to deal with this however we are now in an impasse where left and right have politicized everything they can think of and the process of achieving effective legislation in the short to medium term is nil. Executive Orders as started by President Obama you say yet surely by-passing Congress is doing what you decry as undermining the Government.
As long as it’s just as easy to get off the list as it is for a Terrorist Organization like Delta to put you on the list. Rule of law? Yes. But there must be a fast and easy review process to get off the list when butt hurt clowns at airlines put you on the list, without just cause or because they want to.
It says something sad about where we are as a culture that this idea is even being seriously discussed. The Rule of Law has always been central to our society, but ever since 9-11 there has been a growing notion in many corners of our society that “those people” don’t deserve civil rights. “Those people” might be muslims, nazis, communists, LGBTQ activists, MAGA hat people, anti-vaxers, or whatever group represents a “threat to America” in one’s mind. We should be willing to stand up for anyone’s rights, no matter what group they represent. Rule of Law means that when someone commits a crime, they are charged with the crime, given the opportunity to defend themselves in a court of law, and if convicted by a jury of their peers, they are sentenced to a punishment in line with the law. Congress is certainly able to raise the penalties for bad behavior on airplanes, but extrajudicial removal of rights without due process is something that no American should want for anyone in our society. The challenge of a free society is never protecting the “good” people or the popular speech. The challenge of a free society is protecting the rights of the awful people and the offensive speech. We must do both.
@Gary: Good catch. Bastian’s anti-liberty bias shows up again. Thank God he doesn’t have more power over legislatures.
Yes. Let the airlines make their own lists. And where there are no mental health issues involved, take a few disrupters to court in highly-publicized cases. That’s an ample deterrent. There’s no need to make this a government thing. That’s a cop out.
Delta is trying to be the airline of the wanna-be elite. Think mid-high level managers and consultants from NY who think they are smart because they went to a top-25 university and have an MBA. These people would love to not have to fly with the MAGA hats, shaniquas, and truckers on vacation to FL. Hence the reason Delta is trying to promote this list. It will be legal segregation all over again , except this time by “class” and social credit score. Even the “possibility” you could pose a threat to flight crew because you like a Trump post will be enough for them to deny you boarding.
The lack of due process did not work out well foe the elites in Canada. Bastian should stick to accounting and leave the law to lawyers
The fact that Bastian is a King in the Air Travel universe and yet is apparently oblivious to the fact that there are many, many people who have apparently been dumped onto a no fly list and have significant trouble finding out even WHY (let alone getting off the list) is very telling about how out-of-touch airline leadership is.
Or, maybe he does not what a problem it is, and is just being dishonest in his dismissal of the issue.
Ed has clearly lost his marbles – like our president. How incredibly naive to no understand the significance of what he’s proposing.
People Like Bastiat don’t care about the rule of law because they are above it.
Just so we’re clear about what was proposed, Delta’s ask was limited to people convicted of crimes aboard aircraft. So you all can stop whining about loss of rights and liberties. Moreover, the only role the government would play here is to sanction the creation of a no-fly list by agreement among the airlines which might otherwise create antitrust concerns. The administration of the list would be relatively straightforward and would have provisions dealing with inappropriate additions to the list. As things stand now, the miscreants who threaten the lives of passengers and flight crews are undeterred because they can always just fly on another carrier. The no-fly list would at least make clear that violence on-board will be met with a total ban, as many sane people believe should be the case.
@ Gary — Bastian really belongs at Marriott.
Bastion really only cares about one thing – DL stock price which determines his (pay) total compensation package!
From your comments I thought he’d changed his position, but no. He said:
“That is why I have proposed that any person convicted of a crime because of an onboard disruption be added to a national, comprehensive “no-fly” list of unruly passengers.”
I’d rather the criteria were tightened further, but this doesn’t seem like an abuse of liberty nor throwing away the rule of law.
I’d argue this is purely a play to get ahead of Sara Nelson and her efforts to unionize Delta. Bastian can argue that the company is just as capable of advocating for their workforce as the AFA, and no need to sign those pesky union cards.
Ed Bastian – Woke and Weak.
Wow, so many people here choose to not read the actual op-ed. The proposed list is for persons convicted of crimes onboard airplanes. Due process remains intact in this case. This is not some secret committee or cabal putting names on lists.
Gary, you are an idiot on this one. Go reread the op-ed and present a more factual write-up. Bastian did not ask for an executive order. He asked the federal government take this up. YOU, Gary, made the argument that this must be an executive order.
Yes, our government is essentially non-functional. Maybe something as simple as this effort could pass in Congress. However, you outright dismissed the idea. To argue this is an executive decision and push partisanship is reflected in your chucklehead comment section. Good job Gary.
Signed RTFA
@Paul M Ruden
Plus one from me. Half the idiots on here, never bothered to read the Opinion Letter to the Washington Post!
Gary, you failed again! Another baseless political propaganda post to induce clicks!!!
An individual who commits a crime on an aircraft and then is convicted, DOES NOT DESERVE TO FLY ON ANY AIRLINE!!! Did I say that loud enough? Only a nimrod idiot would allow proven criminals to indiscriminately be allowed to commit another crime! Myself and all Americans deserve to be able to fly safely!!!
Gary, did you actually read Bastian’s comments? Sure, you copied and pasted some of they key words, including the criminal conviction requirement, but you clearly didn’t register what that means… It seems like you just saw the words “no fly list” and assumed Bastian meant something like the terrorism no fly list (which is arbitrary and unchecked), and went off on a rant from there.
I watched passenger behavior deteriorate over the years and and fully supported of this idea. I see no reason why a service provider should be involved in law enforcement, or mental health care.
All these comments about woke, and elite contribute to the problem. Get Congress to do its job and stop putting the burden on employees trying to serve a damn Coke!
I watched passenger behavior deteriorate over the years and and fully supported of this idea. I see no reason why a service provider should be involved in law enforcement, or mental health care.
All these comments about woke, and elite contribute to the problem. Get Congress to do its job and stop putting the burden on employees trying to serve a damn Coke!