Earlier in the month I surveyed the various hotel programs and their ability to get you into suites and upgraded rooms using points, not just status.
The two best programs for this are Starwood Preferred Guest and Hyatt Gold Passport. In fact, Hyatt is insanely generous. If you’ll book the ‘Hyatt Daily Rate’ then you can confirm a suite, at time of booking, for up to four nights, for just 6000 points. I asked a bit later, why ever stay in a regular room at Hyatt?
Here’s how much more generous Hyatt is with suite upgrades (with points, available even to general non-elite members) than the second best program for suites, Starwood:
[W]hile a hotel like the Westin Tokyo will cost an extra 20,000 Starpoints per night for a suite, confirmed only five nights in advance, Hyatt Gold Passport will let you confirm an upgrade at the much nicer Park Hyatt Tokyo for just 6000 points. Total. For four nights. At time of booking. Crazy.
The category 6 Westin Times Square would cost 80,000 Starpoints to upgrade for four nights. The Andaz 5th Avenue costs 6,000 Hyatt Gold Passport points for those four nights. And the Andaz upgrade is confirmable at time of reservation. And I generally consider Starwood to offer the second best program for upgrades.
But what happens if things go wrong? You confirm a suite at booking because you really, really want that suite. It may be pivotal to your hotel experience, maybe because you’re traveling with a child or because it’s your honeymoon. You travel all year on business and want one special trip with your family. You go with Hyatt because you don’t want to take any chances, no arguments or negotiations at check-in, you really want that suite.
What happens if the hotel just gives your suite away? It’s ‘confirmed’ but when you get there they hand you the keys to a regular room. What do you do? What are you entitled to?
Now, there are legitimate reasons this can happen. The suite the hotel had assigned you to has to be taken out of service for a deep cleaning or repairs, who know what those guests before you did to it! And if the hotel is completely sold out, they can’t just give you another suite.
The first thing they should try to do is give you a better, bigger suite. But in a true sellout they may not have that option.
There are also more nefarious reasons this can happen. They just decide your reservation is less important than someone else’s they want to give a suite to. You’re the unlucky one they bump, they figure they’ll just deal with you as an unhappy customer in order to make someone else’s stay better. That’s probably what happened to me about a week ago.
My Downgrade Experience at the Hyatt Regency San Francisco
Reader Michael reports getting a suite at this hotel for a $20 tip to the clerk at check-in. Maybe I should have tried that instead of confirming my suite with a Diamond suite upgrade certificate. 😛
I checked into the Hyatt Regency San Francisco, the one down on the Embarcadero, at about 9pm. A late arrival, when the hotel is sold out, makes it probably more likely that a downgrade is going to happen to you. If they are going to wind up downgrading someone, checking in after everyone else puts you in a worse position (if all the suites have actually been given away, being the squeaky wheel doesn’t get you a suite and someone else downgraded instead).
I walked up to the checkin desk and the clerk simply issued me keys. He wrote down the room number and that’s when I realized something was up. I had decided to burn my last Gold Passport Diamond suite upgrade that was expiring at the end of February. And I even knew which specific room I was supposed to have – the hotel was putting me in one of their least desirable suites (3rd floor, balcony over the cable car) and had wanted to make sure I would be happy with that before we confirmed the booking. I was fine with it. So when I had a room on an upper floor, I asked the clerk at checkin what kind of room I was given? He said it was a club floor room with a balcony. Ummmmm…..
I explained I had confirmed a suite, and he went to get the manager on duty.
She came out and introduced herself, extended her hand to shake mine but barely took it (weakly) before pulling away. This wasn’t the manager least wanting to interact with me at checkin — that was years ago at the then-Westin Rio Mar in Puerto Rico where no room was available for my checkin after 4pm and I wasn’t happy just buying myself -drinks until they decided to make one available, a manager came out and wouldn’t look up at me while he typed away at a keyboard and gave me a giant suite (rather than comping my drinks). But she was close.
The manager told me not to worry, she would ensure that my suite upgrade is returned to my account.
Me: that does not make it ok.
Then she claimed it was “Hyatt’s fault and not the hotel’s since it wasn’t ever confirmed here.”
Not true. Not only was the suite upgrade certificate taken from my account, but space had only opened up a week before and the suite upgrade was confirmed with the hotel into a specific room. She then backed off the claim. And what difference would it have made anyway?
As far as I was concerned the suite was confirmed, whether by Gold Passport or the hotel was immaterial, something should be done to make it right and the hotel pointing fingers to resolve itself wasn’t helpful. If they wanted to go back at Hyatt, that’s between them and Hyatt and shouldn’t be an issue for me to deal with.
The conversation shifted to how to fix this, I asked about better suites and was told the hotel was completely sold out. I believed that, and also that all suites were checked into.
Manager: Well, I would be happy to have us buy you dinner in the restaurant.
I had no plans for dinner on-property. And a dinner doesn’t, to me, make up for not having a suite for my stay.
Manager: We could do a $150 room credit instead.
To me, and maybe others will disagree on the value of a suite or what I should have been entitled to, but $150 doesn’t even come close. Maybe $150 per night.
I push back and she offers 15,000 Gold Passport points. Then she ups it to 21,000 points (adding the number of points that would confirm a suite on a Hyatt Daily Rate booking although this stay was on a conference rate).
She kept insisting that I was actually not out anything at all because I could simply use the suite upgrade at a different time. I would still get a confirmed suite, just not on this stay, so nothing is lost.
I kept insisting that what I lost is a suite (and I would be getting four more suite upgrades shortly, plus could confirm suites whenever I wished with points if they were available so getting back a suite upgrade isn’t valuable to me). And now I spend 3 nights in a non-suite, even though I had confirmed a suite. What I was ‘out’ was the suite on this stay.
So I tried a different tact. I asked her what the difference in price was between a regular room and suite? She wouldn’t give me a number at first, and of course it’s true that it can vary. I asked though, “what’s the minimum, the lowest you’ve seen?” and she said $200.
So we agreed that I am receiving — at the bare minimum — $600 less of room on this stay because they aren’t honoring my confirmed suite. So I said the hotel should compensate me at $600. She countered with 45k points. Perfectly fine. I was going to bed….
But first I made her put it in writing. It was such a hassle to get to the solution, I didn’t want any more drama. She was new to the property and didn’t have business cards yet, so couldn’t give me her card, but wrote down what was going to be done for me and signed it. At least I had proof, in case she decided later that she had been too generous.
What Should Have Happened?
It shouldn’t have been an argument or hostile negotiation at check-in, but it turns out that it wasn’t wrong for it to be a negotiation.
I reached out to Hyatt to find out what the procedure is supposed to be — What can a member expect? What are they entitled to?
I was told,
Yes, certainly confirmed upgrades should be honored. From time to time, there may be unforeseeable circumstances at a hotel that make a suite unavailable. In the event the hotel is not able to honor the award at the time of arrival, it is at the hotel’s discretion to make it right for the Diamond member. Hyatt Gold Passport and Hyatt associates value our loyal guests, and we do our best to exceed expectations during each member’s stay.
So in short, you were right to express frustration that your award was not honored; this is never intended. I’m glad to hear that after discussion you were eventually taken care of properly. Advice for members would be to inquire about the cause for not being able to honor the award and speak with a manger if needed so it’s made right.
I followed up on the email with a phone call. I really did want to know what the hotel was obligated to, whether there were any penalties for hotels that confirmed an upgrade but didn’t honor it.
What I was told is that they are expected to honor it. That there’s a solid training program and ‘followup’ although I didn’t get specific details on what the followup entailed.
Hyatt insisted there wasn’t a one size fits all rule for how to compensate a guest. And that makes sense, some people might prefer a room credit or meals, maybe daily breakfast or late checkout over points as a way to make that stay better rather than compensating by way of future stays.
The good thing is that the hotel is supposed to make it right. The bad thing about a lack of clear guidance on how to do it is you can face a check-in situation like I faced: you want to get to your room, a manager tells you that you aren’t actually entitled to anything, and you have to debate them on the value of what you’ve given up.
Although I was certainly happy with the result. Frankly on this stay, where I was burning a suite upgrade just so it wouldn’t expire, I was happy to have traded it for 45,000 points (and if I had been given the upfront option to ‘trade’ the suite upgrade certificate for those points I would have happily taken it). So I was more than made whole.
But if this had been a ‘special’ stay, a week in Hawaii perhaps, I might have felt differently.
What is Appropriate Compensation for a Downgrade?
Hyatt wouldn’t provide me guidance on what I should have asked for, again suggesting that each situation is different. Honestly I really hadn’t thought through in advance what I should have been asking for, so I was a bit taken aback at the checkin desk. I had some sense that a dinner was insufficient, that 15,000 points was insufficient (it equated to 5000 points per night), but I didn’t actually have a good idea of what should have made things ok.
The Hyatt Regency San Francisco is a Gold Passport category 4 hotel, so a free night is 15,000 points. There’s a certain symmetry to enough points for a free night for each night I was downgraded.
Has this ever happened to you? What kind of compensation were you offered? What should I have been happy with?
I know now at least that a hotel provided me with points equal to each night of my downgrade, so that would probably be my starting point in the future, but on this stay that might have been too generous while on another stay I’m not sure it would make me happy. What would you see as reasonable?
Ultimately I was quite happy with the stay, I’ll follow up with a report on the hotel and have an upcoming stay at the Grand Hyatt as well so will be able to contrast the two. The best part was the club lounge, which had quite a bit of substance to the food offerings and just an amazing view.
I think 45,000 points is a pretty good offer in the circumstances. When the same has happened to me I have been offered a better upgrade on my next stay, and the upgrade cert back. (In my case, it was mid-year so it had more value than in the case of your correspondent).
The converse of this is a property that opened up a super large suite when their normal upgrade suites were sold out for my stay.
I suppose it can work either way.
“And what difference would it have made anyway?”
Channelling Hillary. Very nice!
I can’t speak to Hyatt, but Westin Diplomat did not honor my guaranteed “Your 24” at check-in early one morning after an overnight flight from Santiago, saying they had no rooms and the guarantee was for 24 hours, not for the specific check-in time.
This was clearly false and the Ambassador Desk intervened. Ended up getting a suite immediately at their golf course property down the road and a $75 credit for my one night stay on a cheap govt rate. Wasn’t really impressed by the property, style over substance.
This story comes across as pretty entitled and becomes thoroughly revolting when you acknowledge you’re just burning a certificate you don’t particularly care about anyway. Somebody screwed up, that happens. Don’t put them on the rack for it.
@Gary, I think 45k pts is more than fair for your trouble…hell, it’s enough for 2 nights at a Park Hyatt!
So whats going to happen to your confirmed suite upgrade cert? will it get extended?
Happened to me at Westin SFO. I had one night and figured I’d need the space for business work, so I booked it. Got to the room, it was a regular room.
Went to the desk, the manager could not have been more helpful. A suite had to be taken off line, and they pulled mine thinking it was a comp upgrade and not a confirmed one. He was honest and upfront. Really nice guy.
They comped my dinner ad gave me 10k star points (cat 3 hotel, 7k per night). No negotiating on my part – that was his initial offer. I thought was more then fair. Then the next morning upon checking out, he came up to me asked how everything was, and where i was headed. When I told him into town, he walked to the taxi stand, talked to the driver, and comped my taxi into SF.
Can’t say how impressed I was with how he handled it – honestly, apologetic, and more then fair. Sounds like the opposite of your stay
So is it true that you can use the Diamond confirmed suite upgrades on conference rates (where the whole hotel is blocked out in advance and I am unable to book from the Hyatt website)? I’ve been told in the past that I could not do this.
@Jimmy – You can’t use points to upgrade a conference rate but I’ve not had problems using Diamond confirmed suite upgrades on any rate booked with Hyatt provided a suite is available.
@Zing – the confirmed suite was returned to me (after some followup prompting). I haven’t asked for an extension. Since it only needs to be APPLIED by the expiration date rather than used by then I’ll just apply it to a future stay before the expiration
Boy, someone’s a little grumpy. At what point did you ask the manager, DYKWIA??!
@Corky I suppose I’ve rationalized after the fact, and after a perfectly fine stay and nice club lounge, that I didn’t much care in the end. That I was happy. I was mostly unhappy with the process at checkin — being told that the hotel hadn’t even confirmed the suite in the first place so it wasn’t their fault, that I wasn’t out anything, a starting place that I should just get my expiring suite upgrade back. And then the insistence that the inconvenience was of little value.
And then the post is really about exploring what should happen under these circumstances? What *is* reasonable to expect? In my case I was more than treated well… in the end. But what if it was a really special stay? Does that matter?
@John – never! What would you have done in my shoes?
This was a very useful post. I often use my suite upgrades on business trips for meetings with my “team.” Once, in Madrid, a very large chain hotel didn’t have any suites available, even though I had confirmed one. After I explained the reason I had booked a suite to the manager, he offered the hotel’s staff conference room for our use, together with complimentary sodas, water and sandwiches. Very nice.
Gary, job well done! I’m impressed by the compensation you negotiated. For my own reference, did you have to stay adamant about the fact they were offering you an insuffiient comp, and remained persistence about more compensation? In other words did you have to grill the FDM for a more suitable comp? I’m curious what is the best approach in this type of situation.
Great post, Gary.
I think it speaks volumes to declining expectations for customer service when commentators claim that you were being overly dramatic and grumpy about the fact that the hotel did not honor your suite upgrade.
Quite frankly, I see minor mistakes like this as an opportunity to press for points, comps, etc, that can more than make up for the difference between a suite and regular room.
If you can make it uncomfortable and expensive for the hotel to NOT honor your confirmed upgrade, you make it more likely that they won’t repeat the mistake in the future. You also are able to get compensation that often more than makes up for the failing.
Case in point, I stayed at the Westin Grand Central this month on a double double reservation that I figured would be upgraded to a deluxe double double, which would have been perfectly fine. Instead, I was put in a single handicapped king room. This was a downgrade over the paid reservation! I’ve never had that happen as an SPG Gold, much less in my experience as a Hilton Gold or a Kimpton Inner Circle member (which is always phenomenal, IMO the best on-property benefits in the US).
After multiple conversations with the front desk, then the SPG folks, then the hotel’s service manager, I was given 18k Starpoints as compensation and a personal invitation to revisit the property as a VIP. At the end of the day, in a market as competitive as NYC, there is no chance that I would have ever considered returning to the property had they not gone through all the trouble of personally calling me and offering me compensation equal to a “re-do” night at the hotel.
If you don’t push for the hotel to make things right, your experience will be diminished, and the experience of guests to come will be, as well. It’s not being “grumpy” or “unhappy,” it’s expecting that the property will treat you with respect and honesty.
Given the content, the length of this post is is breathtaking.
Interesting article
Hyatt Regency San Francisco is one of the last hotels on my list
IMHO they do not respect Diamond guests or most Gold Passport guests/They have always been stingy and penny pinching with a semi hostile management.I can’t say if thats still the case having not been back in some years.
Based on your need for negotiation it looks like not much has changed
You definitely milked those utters.
@Mark, well I *do* aim for breathtaking!
I probably would have settled for less, even 15K points. I think the standard rooms are pretty good even if they aren’t a suite. But congratulations on doing better!
Way to stick to your guns! I don’t know that we will be able to make the hotels change their business models, because there will always be plenty of guests who go quietly into the night and accept their downgrade without a fuss, but every little bit helps!
Great report Gary. I have an upcoming stay at the Grand Hyatt San Francisco (using a confirmed suite upgrade), so I’ll look forward to hearing your report on that location. 3rd week in February- if our trips align – and you want to meet up for a beverage in the lounge.
Please, Gary would never say DYKWIA??!, he would say DYKNWTFIA??! 😉
@Shannon M – I’ll be there before you, you should see my report in advance of your stay. Best, Gary
@corky – “This story comes across as pretty entitled and becomes toroughly revolting..”
you lost the point of the story. does not matter if he just found & picked up the certificate on the street & used it. people like you had no appropriate knowledge & wont help anyone learn anything.
Thanks Gary for sharing the experience and the critically important thing of having it all down on paper. You just saved people tons of time learning this on their own.
@Gary – Sounds good. As an aside, there is also an area of compensation that I’ve entered a couple of times when I’ve booked rooms online during a mileage or mattress run and the hotel was sold out. My first time I mistakenly settled for 5k Hyatt Gold points, so that was a lesson learned in terms of qualifying the compensation equivalency.
Why not just move to a suite the next night? Very long post.
I like this post, and do wonder what happened that caused you to be bumped from your confirmed suite? Was it given to another customer? At what price? By whom?
Apologizing is nice, and compensating you is even nicer, but ensuring these things don’t happen would be nicest. The fact that they do happen on a regular basis, for largely negotiable reasons, is a problem.
I enjoyed the post. I’m betting that had they been honest with you, you would have been happy with less. Instead, they took your confirmed room away from you and hoped you wouldn’t notice. Next, they lied to you that it wasn’t their fault. Finally, they tried to tell you that you weren’t out anything. That should irritate anyone.
Would things have been different had you been greeted with an apology and an explanation for their error?
Honestly, I think this is being greedy.
If I were in your shoes, I would’ve been fine with the suite upgrade being returned to my account and $150 in room credit.
@FormerAirlineEE – nailed it….
@ScottL the manager at checkin promised I would be ‘the first one called’ if a suite opened up during my stay. No call came…
I’m the guy who got the suite for $20 and I feel abut bad that I’ve shared that – for a variety if reasons.
That said, the suites are not that nice ( nothing conpared with the Grand Hyatt) and, to me, 45k points is a major score (two nights at the place vendor!!!)
@FormerAirlineEE has it nailed. It’s entirely possible the hotel had a legitimate reason for taking the suite back, but hoping Gary wouldn’t notice, and then lying to him and trying to cast off blame — that’s just lame. I would have been beyond annoyed at that treatment.
If they had greeted him with a sincere apology and asked how they could make things better, I suspect everyone would have walked away happier.
Jeez Gary, seems as if you have struck a nerve. I don’t blame you one bit for sticking it to the property, AFTER they tried to stick it to you. Enjoy your 2 free nights at the Park Hyatt Tokyo!
Had Gary just flashed his ReviewerCard, none of this would have happened.
I kid, i kid.
I booked a suite through the hotel website so that we wouldn’t have to sit in the dark and whisper when our toddler took her naps, even called several days before arriving to confirm the reservation. Was informed upon check-in that the suite was not available because the previous guest didn’t check out that morning, and the best they could offer was a jr. suite until the previous guest decided to check out. No additional compensation offered. Later that day we called the front desk to remind them that we’d be willing to move asap if the standard suite opened up, and they responded by asking if we had used the bathroom yet.
It was Holiday Inn Express so maybe much can’t be expected? We even ran into the GM on the elevator and mentioned our situation, and he responded with a “sorry about that.”
Should I have fought harder for better compensation? At least my story won a prize for Mommy Points’ “Worst of 2012” giveaway!
That was pretty good! 45k points is very nice, I would be happy! Welcome back to the good side;-)
In a related question we are Diamond members staying at the Hyatt Kauai. Due to rain there were problems with their power system and they had to close their club lounge. Their effort to remedy this was a call to the room and a note under the door offering to recommend using the other restaurants in the hotel. Their only concession was that if you brought in their note they would honor the club price of beer and wine. They seemed doubtful as to whether they would be able to open by the morning. Any thoughts on what they should be offering as a fair solution?
@Michael – if the club lounge is closed then per the t&c of the program you should get (1) daily full breakfast in the restaurant for up to 4 registered guests in your room complimentary (2) 2500 Gold passport points (once per stay, not per day)
An issue that I haven’t seen discussed is what happens in such events when the guest is an infrequent traveler. Gary, you knew enough to understand what was going on very quickly and realize the need to negotiate. Someone else, (me for example), tired from a day’s traveling and not up on all the nuances, probably would have been fleeced and then riled enough by the experience to make it difficult to get to sleep.
Gary, you said that the negotiations weren’t hostile, but I beg to differ. YOU may have kept your cool, but the property management apparently decided unilaterally and without notice not to honor their agreement with you, then tried to lied to your face to cover up their actions. Their only motivation at that point was to get out of the situation as cheaply as possible. That’s pretty hostile in my book.
I’m not a great fan of more laws and regulations, but this is an example someone could easily point to where the property has put the traveler at a pretty big disadvantage and is extorting them to accept a less than optimal solution. Is it any wonder people see regulation as a solution?
Nothing gets me madder than being lied to by the manager who’s establishment has just screwed up. If the manager says,”We made a mistake, how can we fix it?”, they will get off much easier than starting out with “Someone else screwed up.” 45K is reasonable because of the further strain on gleff’s loyalty to Hyatt based on the manager starting out on the wrong foot.
I believe I have reasonable expectations, and being told my confirmed suite UG was downgraded to a regular room and then blaming someone else is not reasonable.
And Corky, your “thoroughly revolting” had me laughing out loud.
Spent a night at The Westin La Cantera,San Antonio as a SPG Gold. Had requested and was given a 4 pm late check out. Stayed up late till 4 am eating and drinking as this was a special night for my girlfriend and I. The loud sound of someone drilling into concrete woke us up shortly after 9 am. Calls to the front desk and a request to talk to the GM ( was told he was in a meeting) provided no relief. This is their Facebook reply,The Westin La Cantera Resort wrote: “I am sorry the renovation of our newest space disturbed your rest, this is certainly not how we like our guests to start their day. We have shared your experience with the team, including our General Manager. We really appreciate your feedback and suggestion for a noon start time. Please Direct message us if there is anything else we can do to make your stay more enjoyable.” This was our fourth and our last trip here. I do expect to be able to enjoy quiet relaxation when I book a room, and sometimes other guests make that impossible. But to have the hotel themselves to be the source and the problem, that is unacceptable. I had used a 10,000 Starpoint award for this stay, and they refunded 2500 back so far. Am going to talk to the GM,but am not sure what to ask for. Any suggestions ?
Great job in pushing back on the initial paltry compensation offer. Most people would have accepted the first offer and been done with it. I’m not so sure that even the most ardent of us wouldn’t have folded somewhere in the middle.
Gary, thank you for posting. It is always good to learn.
Michael, 20-bucks-suite-grabber…you should NOT feel bad that you shared your experience (you wanted to brag so you did) you should feel ashamed of what you did it. I for once, being Hyatt’s stockholder, feel that you stolen from me.
Robert,
I feel bad that you felt I was bragging – certainly not my intent – I was just supporting a blog I love and doing what I thought was the purpose of the Comments feature: contributing.
I applied my last suite upgrade to the Hyatt in Maui doing it over the phone with gold passport. Later I modified the reservation online. Today I emailed the hotel the confirm the suite upgrade and they told me I didn’t have one and none were in my account. Do you know if modifying the reservation cancels out the suite upgrade? I guess I should call Gold Passport and see if they can find it.