A United Airlines pilot refused to operate flight 1679 from San Francisco to Cancun on Tuesday, and the flight was delayed four hours, after a passenger smoked pot in the lavatory. They were afraid that second hand smoke exposure would cause them to test positive if subjected to a random drug test.
First our flight was delayed due to technical issues, then waiting for the paperwork to get completed someone smoked weed in the front bathrooms. They got removed from the flight then sat on the plane for 40 ish min waiting for crew to figure out what to do. Crew was concerned they got exposed so we deplaned and are awaiting new crew.
Quote from the captain, “I have 30 years left of my career at United, I’m not willing to risk getting drug tested when I get to Houston”
Passengers were given $15 meal vouchers. That doesn’t go far in the San Francisco airport. And to be clear,
- The likelihood of testing positive from secondhand marijuana smoke in a well-ventilated aircraft is laughably low.
- Yet I still understand the irrational fear given FAA drug testing regulations and zero-tolerance airline policies that punish even inadvertent exposure if a positive test occurs.
Virtually any detectable level of marijuana metabolite in urine is considered a failed test, regardless of reason. However secondhand cannabis smoke does not cause positive urine tests at DOT thresholds except in the most extreme conditions – think hot-boxed room, hours of exposure, no ventilation.
Remember that once the plane gets going it will benefit from HEPA air filtration, the pilot is in the cockpit and the passenger was in a lavatory (though it’s unclear which lavatory was used). Any exposure would be brief.
Nonetheless, a positive test could end a pilot’s career after a lengthy investigation and loss of certification. Without evidence of passive exposure the pilot also cannot expect union protection. The pilot also has a duty to report any impairment concerns – if they even believe they might have some risk of impairment they are reported to self-report it.
Good for the Captain !
If I was the pilot, I would have made the same decision. I think it’s totally reasonable. Why risk it? And with the stories about pilots drinking, etc., it’s refreshing to see someone not wiling to take any chances. Now, where is my lighter?
Isn’t a plane waiting to leave not “well ventilated?”
Ah, another so-called Journo who thinks he’s a doctor and knows exactly how pot smoke doesnt affect those around him. There is zero chance that I would fly as a crewmember on this flight.
I understand the pilot’s concern. The idiot smoking pot in the bathroom should be sued for the impact on the airline and each of the passengers. Publicly bankrupting a few of the morons misbehaving on airlines — and making the fact widely known — may help with behavior on planes. Yes, the airline probably won’t recover the costs of the lawsuit, but in the long run if it reduces the number of such incidents, it would be worth it.
Can’t blame the pilot. Idiot passenger? Yes. Pilot? No.
I wonder how long he will stay grounded? It could conceivably stay in his system for weeks. Given the circumstance and his being upfront and responsible about it, there should be a solution. Perhaps a test with no repurcussions – if he is clean then good to go. If it is positive then he remains on the ground until clean. It may even be a workers comp situation. This and the pilot who recently canceled a flight to Hawaii because he didn’t trust the plane after mechanics saying they would fix it later, really shows the professionalism of most crew.
Congrats on getting your MD specializing on Medical marijuana especially the testing aspect. No you can legally give. Medical advice along with the past legal advice and aviation advice. Pilot, DR and attorney all in one. Impressive.
You are quite the renaissance man.
:.)
I agree with others that the pilot made a prudent decision. Even if the odds of a positive test (or even being selected for random testing) are very low the downside if it did occur is massive. Better to get a new plane (clean that one thoroughly) and crew. Shouldn’t have been a huge issue at SFO to get a replacement and pilot was well within his rights to decline to fly.
Only person passengers that were inconvenienced should be upset with it is the idiot that decided to smoke weed in an airplane lavatory (and BTW was apparently also dumb enough to take weed into Mexico). Hopefully not only were they taken off the plane but also charged (weed is legal in CA but not in public locations and certainly not on the grounds of an airport or plane). United should also sue them for damages due to the delay.
I live in Canada, where smoking marijuana is legal. However, it would not be legal for someone to smoke marijuana in an airplane bathroom. Nor would it be legal for a pilot to operate a plane after having smoked marijuana. Under the circumstances, I understand the pilot’s decision.
I oversaw drug testing for years. There is ZERO probability that second hand smoke in a ventilated jet is going to show up on a drug test.
WIMP
@PHL/SFO, I’m not sure it’s only a matter of inhaling secondhand smoke. What if the weed smoker in the loo stashed some of that weed there, for whatever reason, and then the pilot knowingly took off and landed in Cancun? Could the pilot not be arrested for trafficking, because he had advance knowledge that there was an (illegal) substance onboard?
The pilot made the right decision.
100% support the pilot. Not sure why any sane person wouldn’t back the Captain here? Some ass-clown decides that he can smoke pot in the lav. Which, BTW, is against Federal Law. Hopefully, the person(s) were immediately arrested and put on the no-fly list. It takes a lot of schooling/training to become a commercial pilot…I wouldn’t risk that career for a second either.
Sounds like a good call; and after all, it really is the captain’s call, isn’t it? Like, regardless of this particular incident, but if a pilot even just ‘feels’ like something is ‘off,’ they can call out. We might have saved people had more folks ‘talked it out.’ While it is also entertaining, see Nathan Fielder’s second season of The Rehearsal.
The Pilot made the right call IMHO. Any exposure = don’t fly. That’s important not just for his career, but also for the lives of all on the aircraft.
Totally support the pilot. Reason why commercial aviation has been so safe has been because of the “we do not take ANY chances” mentality that has been drilled into the minds of professionals.
This is unrelated but this story reminds me that captain and dispatcher are the only two people who can cancel a flight.
Right call for sure. Weed has an oily smoke that can cling to your hair and clothing. I would want a shower and fresh clothing. The selfish tool that smoked in the lav should receive some jail time for this.
Would that pilot test positive, highly likely no but I get where he’s coming from. Even the slightest chance could end his career and job. Put on the blame on the moron lowlife that smoked pot in the lav.
THC, tobacco, or any smoke isn’t ‘great’ for your health, even second-hand.
I still hold flight crews, and specifically flight attendants, their unions, the Association of Flight Attendants-CWA (AFA), and members, in high regard, specifically for their significant contribution to the end of smoking on flights (and in restaurants, and society at-large, at least in the USA). It’s been 35 years since their victory, and it’s undoubtedly saved countless lives and made for a better, healthier flight experience and society. Thank you.
Sadly, *some* of you on here regularly disparage both flight crews and unions. Shame on you.
And for those of you who still smoke/vape, etc., you don’t have to. It’s an expensive addiction, and it costs you and all of us way more than just the packs; while it’s not ‘easy’ to quit, it’s worthwhile for you and those around you.
I’m very glad the majority support the pilot – as I do.
the issue is not near as much about whether 2nd hand smoke could impact a drug test but that the passenger knowingly disobeyed federal regulations about smoking in the lav; if a passenger has that kind of disregard for laws on the ground, why should the captain risk the possibility this person wouldn’t do something just as bad if not worse in the air?
and, it is entirely possible that Mexico could make a case if the person was stopped on arrival and the person says that the crew knew he was smoking weed before they ever left.
and this flight was just one of UA’s delayed flights yesterday due to the failure of their weight and balance system right at evening rush hour.
They are recovering today and took ownership for the expenses but, on the heels of AS’ IT failure not long ago, it shows that airline IT systems are still subject to any number of issues.
I totally disagree with 30west. He exemplifies the immature thinking of these asshats who can’t stop their self-centered attitudes (smoking marijuana in a plane’s lab). The pilots made the only decision that they could: pulling themselves out of the flight rotation until they know that they are “clean”. Some first-rate b-hole chose to violate the law and inconvenience everyone. You wanna smoke dope? Fine. Just do it on your own time in a place that doesn’t create problems for a planeload of passengers and crew. Dumbasses.
EdSparks58
If the pax got exposed to marihuana smoke, $15 meal vouchers seems kinda low.
@phl/sfo:. I too worked in drug testing for years and you are correct that there was zero chance of him testing positive but there is reason to be an ass. Educate instead of degrading. 95% of people don’t know this because our government LIED to us for decades about marijuana exposure, effects and how long it stays in our system. The author is correct, you need to set in a marijuana smoke hot box for a couple hrs to test positive.
@EdSparks58 is right to admonish @30west, who mocks Gary (and fellow commenters) on their reactions and ‘hot takes.’ Folks, don’t list. Don’t self-censor. Say whatever you wanna say. You don’t have to be a literal ‘expert’ to speak or share. Your thoughts have value here. If you disagree with someone, please engage, challenge them, ideally on-substance, as opposed to mere ad hominems, or juts ignore them.
Ah, *listen (not ‘list’); speaking of lists… how’s that whole Epstein case goin? Still ‘nothin to see there’? @Coffee Please, where you at?
There’s another angle you forgot. What about enthusiastic Federales, north or south of the border, looking to make a collar on a pilot when the drug dog points at a pilot who smells like weed?
San Francisco has some world class addiction help. Maybe the selfish pothead should look into it (yes, that’s addictive behavior when you’re so lacking in self-discipline that you can’t help but get your fix in a *”#$ airliner lav before the flight even leaves).
Good for the pilot for embarrassing this person.
It is not just second hand smoke. What about the pot ashes in the bathroom. The pilot uses that bathroom and then some of the ashes get on the clothes. Pilots fly everywhere all the time, maybe in some country where pot is more illegal, a dog sniffs it on the Pilots clothes. Could be an issue. He made the right decision.
Obviously, the aircraft needs to be taken out of service and thoroughly decontaminated. With the passenger billed for costs and loss of revenue.
@Tim Dunn, you wrote “the issue is not near as much about whether 2nd hand smoke could impact a drug test but that the passenger knowingly disobeyed federal regulations about smoking in the lav; if a passenger has that kind of disregard for laws on the ground, why should the captain risk the possibility this person wouldn’t do something just as bad if not worse in the air?”
Can you explain why you are concerned that the passenger might “do something just as bad if not worse in the air” if, per the passenger quoted by Gary, he/she had already been removed from the plane?
OMG, what if the pilot got coke residue on his hands from handling cash? He should get a couple months paid vaction while he recovers.
I think it was National Geographic To Catch a Smuggler New Zealand. A young woman had trace amounts of an illegal drug (not pot) on the outside of her backpack. They investigated for a while before letting her into the country. She was totally innocent. The trace amounts came from a rave she had gone to a few days before.
LOL: According to 2009 CNN 90% of US bills have traces of cocaine.
In today’s world, why couldn’t the person who smoked, simply take an edible like most grownups?!
Totally agree with the pilot. The pax in question should be put on a no-fly list. He belongs on a Greyhound bus.
In this day and age of edibles who is stupid enough to smoke it in the lavatory? Oh wait… Anyway I have a good friend who’s entire medical practice is FAA flight physicals and he says the process of rehab and getting a pilot recertified to fly after a drug or alcohol incident is a HUGE pain in the Rass. I hope United Airlines does the right thing and ban this passenger for life.
@30west and @PHL/SFO neither of you have any idea what you’re talking about. This pilot made the right call. If you have such a substance use disorder problem that you cannot go the duration of a five hour flight without marijuana you have no business on the plane. This was immature, selfish behavior, our and simple. The conversation ends there.
This passenger should be THANKING the pilot. If they got caught crossing an international border with even a single marijuana leaf they could find themselves in jail for a very long time.
Dumbass should have vaped…
In 1980s, a famous Oil company (in Houston) would routinely swab keyboards to test for drugs.
@Parker — Well said. No notes. 100%.
@Pablo Escobar — That’s the name you chose for this post? Bah!
Jim,
perhaps the issue of what the crew should have done was separate from removing the passenger but I did not read it that way.
the issue is then that the passenger smoked in the lav, regardless of what they were smoking, because that would have been enough to get thrown off of a plane.
still glad that the majority of people here support the pilot -for whatever reasons
100% stand with the pilot. And since the plane is on Federal property, Marijuana is a Schedule 1 narcotic, passenger is arrested and jailed… mostly for being a idiot. Bringing pot into Mexico, another stupid move…
No mention that it also sends a non-subtle message to United Management — your employees likely feel abused when you wave the Rule Book, insist on strict compliance; we are within our rights to demonstrate that it’s mutual.
I’m a major airline opilot in the USA. When mandatory DOT testing came along 35 years ago, the issue of passive exposure to marijuana was laid out to the pilots in a scientific manner. Effectively, you’d have to sit in a car for 30 minutes with everyone else smoking pot, with the windows rolled up, before you’d take in enough to test positive. Attending music concerts surrounded by pot smokers was not an issue. So, I’ve never worried about passive marijuana exposure – even when I’ve been exposed.
I understand the pilot’s concerns. But perhaps it’s time for the science of passive exposure and DOT testing be illustrated again to the broader airline pilot community.
I’m a major airline pilot in the USA. When mandatory DOT testing came along 35 years ago, the issue of passive exposure to marijuana was laid out to the pilots in a scientific manner. Effectively, you’d have to sit in a car for 30 minutes with everyone else smoking pot, with the windows rolled up, before you’d take in enough to test positive. Attending music concerts surrounded by pot smokers was not an issue. So, I’ve never worried about passive marijuana exposure – even when I’ve been exposed.
I understand the pilot’s concerns. But perhaps it’s time for the science of passive exposure and DOT testing be illustrated again to the broader airline pilot community.
A lot of people here clearly know absolutely nothing about weed or how things revolving around weed work. 0.00000000% chance he’d have failed a drug test (based on this incident alone). To the drug dog commenter, drug dogs are trained to smell weed, not the smell of smoked weed. The ash guy, so thought you were joking at first, but sadly, I seem to have been mistaken. The dude who smoked was a complete moron, but the pilot was an ignorant wuss. Bad form all around.
Inflight smoking has been prohibited for decades. The pilot made the right call.
I’m a smoker too (cigars not weed).
Unlike the passenger causing the problem, I have enough self discipline to follow the rules and not smoke onboard the aircraft.
I hope the pothead passenger gets put on the No Fly List for 20 years.
Back in the 1980s, if you tried doing that at most trading firms, their testing system would likely burst into flames…
@Tim Dunn
“why should the captain risk the possibility this person wouldn’t do something just as bad if not worse in the air? … and, it is entirely possible that Mexico could make a case if the person was stopped on arrival and the person says that the crew knew he was smoking weed before they ever left.”
I think the captain would need to be concerned with only this flight. If the passenger manages to hoodwink the airline into letting him on another flight, then well, I really think the captain shouldn’t be taking on personal responsibility for that
I would be upset at the situation if I was a passenger on the flight but I understand the pilot’s actions. Maybe the cabin crew should have locked the lavatories.
@Michael “If the pax got exposed to marihuana smoke, $15 meal vouchers seems kinda low.”
Good point — $15 per person isn’t going to do anything for a plane full of folks with pot munchies. Lol
@Gary “Without evidence of passive exposure the pilot also cannot expect union protection.”
But, there had to be some witnesses who noticed the guy smoking in the lav. Even you heard about it, obviously since you made this post. So surely someone on the plane (besides just the pilot(s) and whoever removed the offending passenger from the plane) knew about the guy smoking
Passenger was a moron and should be banned from flying United, not jailed (weed is legal in CA), but definitely arrested and fined.
Can’t blame the pilot at all for wanting to protect his career, would’ve done the same.
I wouldn’t be happy as a pax on this flight, but totally behind the crew here. It’s probably not just an FAA test to worry about, imagine immigration or FAA equivilant in MEX runs a test and it’s a positive – kind of assume they have the right to do this for flight crew. Then it’s likely more the career the pilot has to worry about.
As for $15 vouchers for the pax – while definitely not enough for a meal, that seems standard, as AC gave us that after we de-boarded their aircraft in SFO a couple of years ago when it went MX before pushback. We got $15 each (and we were a party of 4) – we had already eaten so went to get a few bags of snacks – I think we eneded up with maybe 5-6 bags of chips and nuts total. Definitely wouldn’t cover a meal.
@Mark Rocchio – that is not accurate
Passengers need to understand that their behavior has consequences. Sometimes, those consequences affect other passengers. This time it was only a delay. On the American flight that evacuated due to smoke, passengers leaving with their bags could have cost other people their lives.
“laughable low” “irrational fear”……clearly you are not a commercial pilot who has a career at stake.
Blanket statements from a point of ignorance are to be avoided.
@Krod Mandoon. I travel worldwide. I am paranoid. I agree with your assertion that I doubt that anyone would get in trouble for trace pot anywhere in the USA. But what about any other countries? Scoff if you want to. Probably not, but better safe than sorry.
Watch National Geographic Border Patrol New Zeeland. They have money sniffing dogs. Food sniffing dogs. Drug sniffing dogs. It is amazing how many things dogs are being trained to find.
There is nothing in my profile that would be alarming, otherwise I would not have a Global Entry Pass. One airport security machine in the USA thought that my underarm deodorant was a possible explosive. My cheap Dell travel laptop had been swabbed to check for explosive in Frankfort, Vancouver, London, several airports in the USA, and Tokyo more than once. In Macau, on the way out, they sent me to secondary to make sure I was not carrying too much money. That being said, 98% of the time, I go through security with no issues.
Maybe drug traces are not a problem, but I am paranoid. Sneer if you want, but I would rather be safe than sorry. Further, if I was a pilot, I would be even more careful, because they go through security more in a couple of days than I do in a year.
I wouldn’t be happy, but I wouldn’t be mad at the pilot either. Drug tests dont come with a “some dude was blazing in the bathroom beside me” exemption. You fail a drug test, you’re guilty until proven innocent.
Plus, although its an incredibly small chance, if anything did happen on the flight, you know lawyers would latch onto that exposure to try and paint the pilot as irresponsible for flying impaired in a lawsuit.
I have walked down hotel hallways and have caught a buzz
Pilot is 100% right. The passenger should be prosecuted. In California he would if he smoked a cigarette, but dope for a moron is fine. GOVERNOR Newsom will probably give him a award for resisting federal law.
@Denver Refugee. Your comment about Wall Street and cocaine was pretty funny.
There used to be an Urban Legend in New York that if you at poppy seed bagels before taking a drug test for employment, it could cause a false positive.
First, cannabis is illegal in California under federal law, it’s just not enforced most of the time. Second, Mexico seems to be equally schizophrenic about it. Marijuana has been decriminalized, but that doesn’t mean it can be imported without restriction. My concern would be that if the passenger is subject to arrest upon arrival, not because of what he used in the lav but because of the 5 kilos in his carry-on, then the crew may be subject to arrest also for being co-conspirators.
There was a case years back where an American 20 year old guy was a total pot head and smoked a ton before a flight to either Egypt or Saudi Arabia. Once he got outside the airport he got injured and broke some bones. Was brought to the hospital. They obviously ran blood tests and they arrested him for the drugs in his system. You can google these general words and find the article somewhere.
So yea. I get the pilot reaction.
The pilot made the right call, risk-management-wise.
Dang stoners who flout the law. Makes the rest of us look bad.
I see the general public is poorly informed on second hand smoke and urine drug detection. One joint smoked in another room nearby by someone else is beyond any credible amount of exposure to uptake an amount that could lead to a positive urine sample.
The DOT and the DOD have similar threshold and “positive” levels which are designed to find the user and not some happenstance individual. Why? Because these things usually end up
in court and the government simply does not want to waste time with questionable positives. Simply put, if you test positive, only you are to blame, no friends, small enclosed spaces, or spiked brownies are going to get you there.
While I agree that the risk of a positive test is very low for a DOT test, the fact that the HEPA filters would have any impact on a test result is incorrect. The test uses a urine sample and detects metabolites. Any metabolites would be unaffected by air quality.
Was the captain’s name Karen? Wow what a world of wusses we live in.
Agree with pilot’s action.
Unfortunately, the depth of moranic, self-centered, and thoughtless behavior keeps going lower.
In February, on a SFO-ABQ flight, I was assaulted as were other passengers when they were slammed into the sides of the overhead bins as an irate passenger coming from Economy pushed and shoved other passengers as she pushed her way from Economy to plane door to demand that the lead FA “…put my luggage in the overhead bin because it’s full”, and refused to place it under seat in front of her (“I need room for my feet!”) nor check it (“you people will lose my it!) When the totally chill and professional United FA asked her to return to her seat, she proceeded to berate the lead FA in Economy. The pilot, correctly, cleared the plane; errant passenger was taken aside and forbidden to reboard. We only lost 20 minutes. Amazing professionalism of United crew.
Nothing surprises me anymore, and I am mentally prepared for diversions and cancelled flights. What a society we now have.
While the risk of testing positive for drugs via second hand smoke may be remote, the penetration and smell of the smoke on the pilots, cabin crew, passenger clothing, and the interior of the aircraft, will raise all sorts of eyebrows. I agree with the pilot’s assessment and would stand by his decision regardless of what others may think. I trust that United will feel the same way, ban that passenger and send him the bill for the deep cleaning required. Then, UAL should compensate the inconvenienced passengers with sufficient “goodwill”.
Hopefully that person in the Lav is now on a no fly list and gets federally charged since its still illegal according to federal laws.
Typical drug user, this has become so common especially with vape that are loaded with THC and morons doing it in public around people.
Hopefully laws will start going back the other direction and all these drug addicts can go back to doing it away from the public.
Another thing to remember about legal marijuana. Just because it is legal in one state does not grant you the right to travel with it or use it in other states and transport across state lines. And in this current administration, rules are in the air. You might be able to get away with it if caught but others might not in the same situation. Even though second hand smoke might not seem like much but people will treat you differently if they smell drugs on you even if they aren’t yours. The potential impacts to one’s career or health might not be worth it. And furthermore, studies mentioned in other comments around how tests are conducted and that this second hand smoke would not show up in urine test is probably true based on the weed they tested previously. But the strains they have out today are stronger and more potent and I’m sure that has an effect on the second hand smoke. I absolutely would have made the choice the captain made for all the above reasons.
If you can’t smoke on a flight it doesn’t matter what you smoke. He broke a federal law. Good for the crew to shut down. The person smoking is an idiot and screwed everyone over in that plane. Hope he gets a visit.
@Gregory B Cotten:
The problem is we have many, many examples of drug testing witch hunts. In a reasonable world there would be no risk, but many of us do not trust the system to be reasonable. (Things like requiring drug testing at birth–and failing women for stuff administered by the hospital during labor.)
@Other Just Saying:
Urban legend? Not if they’re being unreasonable:
https://ufhealth.org/news/2023/can-eating-poppy-seeds-affect-drug-test-results-addiction-and-pain-medicine-specialist
Medical Review Officer here. No you could not possibly inhale sufficient THC in this situation. We’ve done the testing. If the air is on in the A/C, you will get 100% washout in no more than 5 minutes, even with max recirculation through the HEPA filters.
Any positive test (and yes you used to be able to screen positive at a low level with poppy seeds for opiates) must be reviewed by an MRO after a second confirmatory test. The cutoff level for THC cannot be reached by any reasonable secondary exposure, otherwise most of Manhattan would be positive.
This would be a federal offense since it was onboard a plane with cockpit crew in place. Whitmire is quite correct about the smell penetration, which is noted at parts per billion. What an idiot!
Sounds like Captain Panic Attack needed some emotional support Narcan.
Excellent call from the pilot and crew.
@Other Just Saying — If you re-read what @Denver Refugee said, “most trading firms,” so I guess ‘Wall Street’ (in the 80s) was implied. And, pretty sure the ‘poppy seed bagel’ thing was a Seinfeld bit (In season 6 episode 16, the Shower Head, Elaine tests positive for opium in a blood test. She finds out it’s because she eats poppy seed muffins everyday.) They confirmed it true on Mythbusters. So, go easy on the bagels/muffins.
@Alexander Castleberry — You’re like the only person on here against the pilot. Yeesh.
@1990 – We got a contrarian in the house, or should I say, la “CAS,A”
@L737 — Yeppers. Sounds like he’s flyin’ from Fukuoka, Japan to Oshawa Executive Airport in Canada, if you know what I mean…
@1990 — Well PLA-YED (Planadas, Columbia – Canadian Forces Base Edmonton Heliport)
@L737 — Even though all the Canadian airports start with ‘Y’ we still managed to use them. A real ‘Guangzhou to Dorobisoro‘ spirit here. CAN-DOO.
@Other Just Saying:
It is not an urban legend… Eating poppy seed bagels can in fact result in a positive drug test for opiates.
Poppy Seed Consumption May Be Associated with Codeine-Only Urine Drug Test Results – PubMed https://share.google/uF2ONZqwtAFHwhzm4
HEPA filtration doesn’t remove anything but particles from air. Volatile non-particulates, like THC and other cannabinoids, are present as gas (can’t be captured at all) and vapor (maybe a little might condense). So, it would remove the soot from the smoke, but not the things that could cause someone to test positive from second-hand smoke. Carbon filtration, if there is any, might remove a little bit. If you are really lucky, these might be exhausted from the plane and replaced with fresh air. But absent an actual scientific study, any claim that this might not cause the pilot to fail a test is just hand-waving. The best action for the pilot would have been to exit any circulating air from the aircraft as soon as responsibly possible.
It wasn’t your journalistic career that was on the line, so try to see something from someone else’s point of view. We don’t need the “laughably low” commentary. Just report the news. The journalist’s obtuse opinion only detracted from the article.
@alexander castleberry
When it’s your career, and years of your life invested, your time and money invested, then you can say stupid shxt.
@DontNeed YourOpinion – I agree with that. So many good adjectives like surprisingly, extremely, and remarkably. Laughable is fairly condescending sounding to me.
we the frequent fliers who rarely complain and observe the rules are sick of the drunks and smokers, particularly the pot smokers who must smoke in the airport lounge toilets and in the aircraft lavatories. throw them off no refunds. fine them for causing a delay and make them civilly liable to every other flier for the delay.
I’m going to start by assuming this was the forward lav, right behind the cockpit. Posters talking about air filtration don’t understand the issue here. In flight the aircraft is pressurized. Any air that enters the cabin from an open lav door will eventually be vented either overboard via the pressurization control valves or mixed with engine bleed air and sent back to the cabin. Yes, that air is filtered but none of this even applies to the cockpit. The cockpit always gets 100% fresh air. No recirculated air at all. It is the way the system is designed.
Now, all of what I described above is irrelevant to this case. The aircraft was not pressurized. It was at the gate with the forward entry door open. I am assuming the cockpit door was open. The pilots are sitting about 5 feet from that door. When the law door opened the weed contaminated air would have dissipated through the area. I can guarantee the pilots smelled it. If you can smell it, you are breathing it.
I have no expertise on drug testing or what triggers a positive. I’ll leave that for others. But that pilot was being very reasonable for protecting himself in a zero tolerance environment.
Just for clarification on the above comment:
<<>>. By that, I mean the pilot are sitting 5 feet from the lav door. Plenty close to get that pungent smell.
@DontNeed YourOpinion & @ AsmodeusHare — You fellas looking for ‘journalism’? Then, go to Reuters or the Associated Press. We’re here for the ‘thought leader,’ and he can use whatever adjectives he wants!
Try reporting just the facts. Inserting your personal opinion “effects are laughably low” illustrates your ignorance, disrespect for a profession and is everything that is wrong with “journalism.”
On the bright side, you could have a brilliant career with CNN or MSNBC.
There’s nothing “well ventilated” about an aircraft parked at the gate. Sometimes your ignorance is amazing.
ALL of the second hand smoke studies were done with weak 60’s hippie weed. The fact is no one knows what this new 30% THC weed does on any level.
@Allen Parmet. You said “otherwise most of Manhattan would be positive.” That made me laugh (in a good way): For example, often there is a strong smell of cannabis when I come out of the subway at Columbus Circle and am walking up Central Park West.
I understand the pilot’s reticence. I had a similar issue at work: I was working the mail room during the lockdown at a law office. They received a check for the law office that needed to be deposited. Because of lockdown, the only people in the office were me and a single legal secretary. The check needed someone to write “For Deposit Only” on the check and then to have it sent along to Accounts Receivable. On that day, I was the only person physically in the office.
And I told them no, I wouldn’t do it. I was not employed by the law office directly but rather through an office services company. As such, I should not be writing anything official on a check for the law firm. Yeah, “For Deposit Only” isn’t a big thing, but never underestimate the ability of a lawyer to cause trouble in case something goes wrong. If it does, I’m going to be the one left holding the bag. And since I don’t work for the law firm, they won’t be the one protecting me. The office services company wouldn’t protect me, either.
And from the law firm’s perspective, it protects them, too. Again, suppose something goes wrong. What are their clients going to think when they hear that the mail clerk is altering checks.
So even though the actual risk is trivial, it still isn’t worth it. I generally think “zero tolerance” is ridiculous, but there are reasons why behaving as if there were zero tolerance can be a good thing. Don’t smoke anything on the plane. It isn’t just you that is going to be affected.
@Brian — Thank you for sharing your story. However, “never underestimate the ability of a lawyer to cause trouble”… that’s all you needed to say. 100%.
But yet we had to mask up. Stick to your expertise in “miles”. Smoking on an aircraft is a federal offense and there were children and infants on that plane.
Airline Pilot here! I totally agree with the United Pilot for his decision. It’s his career and reputation and family life and his career! No amount of convincing is going to change my mind. If it is not your career and decision to make, I’d suggest sit back and start driving as fast as you can, or take the delay and get there, when you get there SAFELY!
FLY SAFE!
Until we actually make pax FINANCIALLY responsible for the delays and cancellations they cause (of course, with a fair trial, not just TSA or the airlines word) nothing is going to change. They are threatened with jail and bans but that does not seem to work based…
I am surprised Pot made it all the way to the Plane barthroom. isn’t bringing it onboard, through a security federal building, and transporting it to another country illegal? That alone would be a major fine for the passenger. To get to where it happened. + Stopping a flight to transit altogether.