Comments

1. Gary. Your industry knowledge is weak sir. This contract SUCKS and I’m guessing it will get voted down.

2. @ Gary — 19% over three years only keeps up with inflation of 8.5%, 5.5%, 4.0% for 2022, 2023 and 2024. Doesn’t seem crazy at all.

3. It doesn’t even remove airport standby language is my guess or that would have been featured on the notes. AA labor relations will be in for some very turbulent times ahead.

4. If I tip a dollar a smile on UA TATL I’ll bet I’d get change for a fin.

5. Wow, the entitled pilots are out in force on this site today. Do you spoiled babies have any sense that you are paid better and work less than 99% of full time employees. Are you aware that your next best opportunity for employment – one measure or compensation fairness – would probably pay about 1/3 of what a pilot makes. Believe it or not in most industries you don’t get massive compensation increases over time just for seniority. In fact you’re lucky if you tread water in real terms.

6. Johnny… I blocked 91 Hours in October and My time away form Base was 368 Hours. Throughout the month. I worked well over 150 hours to block that 91. the 368 Hours away from base does not even come close to count commuting which most pilots do. Some of the work rules are INSANE and are not as good as these contracts sound. Take. reserve pilot for example. Here is how it works at AA.

   430am.. Leave home
   5am..arrive employee lot, take employee shuttle
   530am..arrive at airport to SIT reserve (yeah, easy money right… not working )
   930am (1 hour prior to the end of your required sit) you are assigned 4 hours of flying starting at 11am. MIA-CLT-MIA but WAIt… in CLT there is a 3.5 hour sit. This is 100% legal and puts you back in base at 6:30pm (IF ALL is on time). 13+ Hour duty day….4 hours of pay. 400 people carried.

   Flying is extremely rewarding I would not want to do anything else. At the same time, we work very hard for mediocre pay. Tell me what other job requires the technical knowledge, training and having hundreds of lives in your hands at a given time that pays less than $100,000 to start.

7. @SMR. Great post!

8. @SMR Supply and demand comrade.

9. Although an interesting example, I’d be more interested in understanding how many hours per week or month the typical pilot actually works (reserve and regular pilot)

   By work I mean the time they are required to be at work.
   Nobody pays anybody for commuting time, so the example above is an 11 hour work day.
   But is that example typical? Rare? Common? Not common but not uncommon?

   If I understood the example, you worked an average of 37.5 hours per week in October. Doesn’t sound too bad. But away from home about 91 hours per week. Doesn’t sound terrible but obviously traveling jobs and staying in hotels = negative lifestyle for most.
   I also assume some or many of those hours would be weekends which always sucks.

   Definitely in line with many professionals (doctors, lawyers, salespeople).

   The pilots I’ve known have done pretty well with a very good lifestyle. Far better than many other professionals I know. (Then again I work 65-70 hours per week, never sitting down, including weekends and holidays, so it’s all relative)

   This doesn’t mean I think their contract is fair or unfair. Simply means that their lifestyle looked pretty good to me.
   Airline employment is cyclical. The thing in pilot’s favor now is that there is a huge shortage of pilots.

10. JRMW Correct no one pays for commutes. Pilots just have to spend more time commuting, getting in and out of airports, shuttle buses and dealing with logistics more than most. The new thing pilots get to do is go through regular security (sometimes multiples times per day). Our Known Crew Member is pretty much a dead benefit nowadays. Our government at work, making all of our lives worse so someone at the TSA can say they have done something.

    @bonvoyedAgain…why are you always getting Bonvoyed? Supply and Demand. Marriott’s loyalty program is only there to sell points to CCCs not reward.

    *Disclaimer. I used AA as an example above, but I do not work for them. That is pretty much how it works though. My airline luckily has NO airport standby reserve. I did hard time in the regionals, thats for sure!!

11. AA only has Airport stand by for FA’s, not Pilots.

12. Tim…. AA absolutely has airport standby for pilots. So does UA.

13. All pilots signed up for this: no one is forcing them to be a pilot; as for commuting, no one is obligated to do so. I worked for an airline and most pilots I encountered in my line of work, thought of themselves as being better than other employees. At the end of the day, without other employees, the plane doesn’t move. It’s that simple.

14. Yes. We signed up for it … not negating that. We just deserve the same pay increase other industries have been receiving , especially in a time we are in need. Pilots are getting extended and working extreme schedules right now. As far as acting as the way A.Wolf described that is a sad shame. I do not feel that way at my airline. I know I am just a plug in the process and it’s everyone around me that keeps the airline running and safe . Most pilots are very decent , good people. There are a few bad apples in every profession.

    You think we are whiny babies? I think that’s BS. I think we work our Butts off to keep you safe. We deal with extreme weather , airline management , ATC delays and simply insanely crazy environments yet keep a perfectly constant safety factor.

15. SMR: thanks for clarification

    Job market is weird.
    In my line of work (healthcare) many support people are getting raises. But doctors in general are getting nothing or minimal increases (2%/yr).

    Luckily for you: Your field has high demand for pilots and good pricing power. Hopefully you sign your contract before the upcoming recession

    Good luck

16. @SMR

    They have short call and long call , they do not physically have to sit at airports for a block of time like FA’s do.