A passenger in the gate area of a Delta flight snapped a photo of a woman preparing to board for Detroit – bringing with her a large dog and four carry-on items.
The dog wasn’t in a bag that fits underneath the seat, which is required for a pet in cabin. She had registered it with the airline as a service animal – but it clearly wasn’t. A pet in cabin is treated as a carry-on which means she should only have had a single personal item with her – not four.
Once on board the Bombardier CR-9 regional jet, the woman found she didn’t fit in first class seat 2A. She didn’t quite have room for herself along with her dog. So the flight attendant on this Delta Connection trip allowed her to move across the aisle to sit in 2C, and for her dog to take 2D. They did this even though both of those seats were assigned to other passengers.
The passenger who was in 2C boarded and was told she had to take 2A. But then the passenger who had 2D boarded. He was given 1C. Then the passenger who had 1C boarded and was told there was no first-class seat for him.
The first class passenger in 1C was “involuntarily downgraded to a comfort-plus seat” which is extra-legroom coach.
Naturally, the passenger who bought only one seat should only have been afforded one seat. Other passengers shouldn’t have been moved – let alone downgraded – to accommodate them. Need more than one seat? You can buy more than one. Although even an extra seat doesn’t increase your carry-on bag allowance.
Despite the shenanigans, Delta Air Lines flight 4331 pushed back 10 minutes early this morning and arrived into Detroit 20 minutes early.
Passengers can bring service animals on a plane, and don’t have to pay extra to do so. They just have to fill out paperwork, which largely amounts to attesting that it’s a service animal.
Emotional support animals aren’t supposed to be a thing on planes anymore, but it’s really an ‘honor system’ sort of thing.
That means that there are still plenty of animals on planes, even if it’s not the Noah’s Ark two of each animal situation that it used to be. The average passenger wanting to bring an emotional support animal also happens not to be very good at handling the paperwork in advance.
We reached the point a while ago that a national register of service animals needs to be made. These animals undergo extensive training and their users deserve all accommodations. However, it is clear that the honor system does not work. Businesses have their hands tied under the present rules, so it is time for the rules to be brought up to date.
Gary, curious how you know for certain the dog is not a service animal. “She had registered it with the airline as a service animal – but it clearly wasn’t.” As the father of a child that has a medical alert service dog, I am rather surprised by your assertion. Did you (or someone else) have confirmed knowledge to make this statement or is it based on your “professional” opinion? Is it because the dog is not wearing a vest? Truly interested in how you arrived at this determination.
The plus sized woman should have been asked to wait in the concourse until all the other passengers were onboard and they could determine if there were any options large enough for her. There should have been ZERO impact to the other passengers so yeah, the flight attendant screwed up. I guess this scenario has never happened, ever, on an airline before, where a flight attendant has to handle a situation like this, c’mon.
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Gary has no clue including any of the details other than what someone tweeted.
Gary has proven over and over again that he is the antithesis of critical thinking but makes stories about hearsay without the facts = his blog wouldn’t exist if he actually researched anything rather than blowing up whatever he comes across and presents it as gospel.
But let’s be clear that Gary is on another of his childish crap on Delta warpaths because I had the nerve to tell him he doesn’t understand airline economics in another article. He argues with well-established and easily accessible facts and then resorts to his anecdotes to try to appeal to the lowest common denominator of his readership.
Grow up, Gary. If you would actually write a whole lot less that IS thought leadership and write the facts – no matter how hard they are for you to admit – you would get a loyal following of intelligence.
@Tim Dunn – “Gary has no clue including any of the details other than what someone tweeted.”
This is funny, since you cannot even seem to read properly, this doesn’t even stem from a tweet.
“let’s be clear that Gary is on another of his childish crap on Delta warpaths because I had the nerve to tell him he doesn’t understand airline economics in another article. ”
That’s even funnier considering the errors you made in your comment earlier.
I agree with the commenters who said that service dogs should be registered so only actual service dogs are allowed on flights. And she shouldn’t have been allowed 4 carryons. And when she didn’t fit, the seats should have gone to the paying passengers first. If anyone should have been bumped out, it should have been her—who broke many of the rules for carryons in the first place. They could have her wait in the boarding area and checked some of her bags, if the flight worked, and if not checked onto the next flight.
you are simply on a warpath with me and you think trashing Delta proves it.
You and you alone are the only one that relies on anecdotal stories to get page clicks rather than explaining what is really happening in the airline industry.
It doesn’t matter how the story came – you NEVER know all of the details because you want desperately to get page clicks and objectivity goes out the window.
Feel free to post all sides of the story and then we will see some objectivity. You can’t because you don’t have it
Doesn’t mean that the FA didn’t do something wrong but we have no idea what was involved because we don’t have the facts – and neither do you.
Grow up and write decent content instead of your childish anecdotes – regardless of the airline involved.
@Tim Dunn “you are simply on a warpath with me and you think trashing Delta proves it.”
Mostly I ignore you!
And why do you think that posting something about Delta has anything to do with you?
This isn’t even ‘trashing Delta’ it’s criticism of industry practices around service animals, but mostly criticism of passengers who lie about their pets being service animals.
@Gary Leff: So it didn’t come from a tweet. You don’t cite your source, so it’s even more questionable.
Service animal needs a ticket period, registered or not
Tim Dunn. Please stop bashing the author. Just state your opinion or comments. Your posts are getting old with your love for Delta and continuing bashing Gary.
@NedsKid – I quoted a passenger on the flight. They have been highly reliable in the past. They shared photos.
I’m a plus size traveler, and while I’m not as plus size as I used to be and could fit in a coach seat now, it would still be uncomfortable for me to do so for anything but very short flights. I “fixed” the problem of needing extra space on the plane by, get this, PAYING for a first class seat.
I did not expect a fellow passenger to sacrifice part of their seat space for me. I did not expect to be given a larger or extra seat that I did not pay for. I knew what was needed for me to fly comfortably and safely, for myself and those around me, and that’s what I booked and paid for. Flying is a privilege, not a right. If you can’t physically fit in what passes for a standard seat these days, either due to width OR height, you need to make other arrangements. If you can’t afford to book a seat that can accommodate your body, you can’t afford to fly.
You can make the argument that airplane seats have gotten too small with too little legroom, and you know what? I’ll entirely agree with you. I personally believe there needs to be some sort of regulations on minimum width/pitch from a safety standpoint alone. I don’t think though that every seat needs to be able to accommodate every passenger of every size.
This is part of a pattern that is unsustainable. Service animals, early boarding via wheelchairs, with a miraculous cure when the flight lands.
This happens because there are no consequences for lying and misrepresentations.
What do you have against passengers who travel with registered service animals? The judgment and assumptions you’ve made in several articles are leading me to unfollow. You have no idea what another human is dealing with health-wise or why she may need a service animal. I say this from the perspective of someone who has had several, who travels frequently, who respects the airline’s decision to shift passengers around but should not be downgrading anyone (without hefty compensation) and as a general observer who enjoys reading travel/airline-related content. Your assumption about others’ health/need for a service animal is just naive and disappointing at this point. If you do not want airlines to allow service animals because of your personal opinion, take that up with the airlines instead of blasting those of us who have reasons for needing service animals that are just none of your business.
This looks to be a smaller airport. Assuming DTW wasn’t final destination, I’d be interested to know what happened when she tried to board the connecting flight.
@Tim Dunn,,,,,,,are you happy?
you sound miserable but not much else going on in your life
While I agree that an honor system doesn’t work, and emotional support animals should not be given the same privileges as service animals (they are legally distinct), how does a national registry fix the problem? It just creates another barrier for disabled folks, especially for rarer uses like migraine or seizure alert. These handlers often train the dogs themselves. And that is perfectly fine under the ADA.
@stacy “What do you have against passengers who travel with registered service animals?”
I have nothing against passengers who travel with bona fide service animals.
I have an issue with passengers who do a real disservice to those whose needs are met by real service animals, claiming falsely that their pets are service animals when they aren’t, and imposing a cost on other passengers (in terms of space, safety, etc).
Just another data point for where society is going. They would have only gotten me off that flight with a nice big voucher. Seems this would have qualified as an IDB.
Maybe it’s a service animal maybe it’s not. It doesn’t look like one. The woman in the photo is large but not 2 seat large. The carryons are over the limit but many passangers push those limits.
I don’t believe it is a flight attendants perogative to make a passenger move. She should have called a gate agent, supervisor or flight captian to straighten out the problem.
If the flight attendend wrongly decided to accommodate her she should have been told to wait and accommodated in economy which is the type of ticket she purchased.
Overside passangers think their special, they are not. They are just oversized and should deal with it. Be cramped or buy 2 seats.
The average passenger who never complains, never rings the call button, never lowers their seat back etc gets stepped on all of the time. It’s time to make everyone shut the heck up and take your seat so the flight can depart on time.
I am perfectly happy.
Gary and others build their business model around creating stories and then leaving those stories open for comment.
There is nothing wrong with questioning not only specific stories and the general strategies of sites.
As has been pointed out, Gary did not provide a source other than an anonymous passenger who has a track record which none of us can see.
And Gary most certainly DID NOT say this is an industry problem in the article – he only threw that in in reply to my comments.
Gary pushes plenty of low quality content out the door with spelling and grammatical issues which are poorly written.
This has nothing about Delta and are hardly trends that I alone have commented on.
What is clear is that Delta posted two anti-Delta articles in a row after I told him he doesn’t understand loyalty program economics despite calling himself a thought leader.
Gary is being a child instead of addressing the root issue which is that half of his articles are about anecdotes that people clearly see as abnormal or are about basic industry principles which Gary doesn’t understand or at least doesn’t explain.
Gary is free to close his comment section if he isn’t willing to take the negative commentary along with everything else.
Why don’t folks respect my emotional support pig & otter? Why only dogs ?
Gary this, Gary that, Gary Gary Gary…. Shut the hell up already.
Fat people who can’t sit in one seat should be made to buy two just as fat people who need to inhale two XL pizzas at Domino’s because one won’t cut it need to pay for both. Society needs to stop bending over backwards for these people who can’t leave their house without their dog (for whatever phony reason). Mentally ill people shouldn’t be allowed on airplanes anyway for security reasons. If you have a REAL need for a service dog, you already know how to conduct yourself to minimize impact on others just as if you have a deadly nut allergy, you already know how to prepare/protect yourself in the case of anaphylaxis.
I can’t stand snooty and entitled rich elites, so I would never fly first class. And since airlines don’t really understand demographics, I’ll be traveling by train, if I ever need to travel.
The issue isn’t the service animal it is that the woman couldn’t fit in a seat. That is bad enough. Everything else is just useless noise.
BTW Gary my daughter has a trained service animal and also trains them for other people. They serve a legit purpose and all disabilities aren’t visible. As for the clown that says they should have a ticket take that up with the Federal Government who has been very clear that service animals are allowed on planes, in restaurants and about everywhere else. Just because Gary and many of you have an issue with it that doesn’t mean it is wrong or will change – get over yourselves!!!
Tim – go AWAY if you don’t like it. Most of us would be happier if you did.
A responsible writer would provide a reason to back up the claim the dog was not a service animal. As for the 4 carry ons, some of these may have been medical items which do not count towards carry on allowance. One example of this is a cpap device can be carried on board without counting towards a passengers carry on limit. That being said the passenger should have coordinated better with the airline to ensure appropriate accommodations that did not disrupt other travelers.
Treat the flea bags like the cargo they are and dump them in carriers in the hold, and fatty boombalatty can but TWO seats in coach.
@Gary Leff: You missed the link of how the information came to you. Saying a passenger told you directly would probably be advisable as citing the source. Otherwise it sounds like the ambiguous “they” who canceled the flight or said no vouchers or whatever.
I have nothing against a legitimate service animal. Likewise, I have nothing against handicap people. However, if you can’t travel without an animal or are so handicapped that you depend upon other people to do basic things like use the bathroom or move around the terminal then I have problems with you flying. Same for elderly people. I can’t tell you how many old people I’ve had to help because they literally lacked the cognitive skills to travel by themselves, let alone with a bag.
Having worked for an airline in the 60’s, 70’s and 80’s it was the rule that if you didn’t fit in a seat and required more room you were required to pay for an additional seat. If the extra seat was not available, you had to rebook for a different flight that could accommodate your size requirement. This is not something new that both passengers and airlines are should be aware of. Now this is an issue that airlines are being accused of discriminating against obese passengers. If a normal size person wanted an extra seat, the same rule would apply. Pay for the extra seat or do without. It is the customers choice, not the airline.
Once again Tim Dunn spouting off nonsense and attacking the writer. Aren’t you all tired of this? The service dog fiasco has gone too far I work in the airline industry and most of their service. Dogs are nothing more than a dog or cat With the vest and paperwork purchased on the Internet. The airlines need to require people to have a veterinarian certificate in order to certify a dog as a service animal. They also need to set size limits for these dogs, except in the case of legitimately blind or deaf persons. You’re right to travel with a pet ( service dog) should not take precedence over other peoples rights to travel In a safe sanitary, comfortable environment. I hope Delta gets sued by these passengers that they deboarded in order to accommodate this woman and her oversize pet
@AC “Gary my daughter has a trained service animal and also trains them for other people. They serve a legit purpose and all disabilities aren’t visible”
I don’t disagree with this at all.
@Tim Dunn: Actually, there is someone writing on this blog who proven over and over again that he is the antithesis of critical thinking but makes stories about hearsay without the facts. That individual is @Tim Dunn, and not Gary Leff.
Emotional support animals arent the same as service dogs. Service dogs are trained and certified. Emotional support animals arent. Property managers have this same battle when dealing with tenants.
@Tim Dunn “Gary and others build their business model around creating stories and then leaving those stories open for comment.”
I do not gain any material financial benefit from the comments. I leave them open so that folks can enjoy them, interact with each other, and call me out if you wish.
You can attack me again and again if you’d like. I do have an issue when you attack others, and that’s when I try to moderate comments.
I guess Tim Dunn is the emotional support animal here.
Wow – this is why we have ADA so the entitled if you are disabled, old, or fat – don’t fly folks are left behind in the discrimination dust where they belong! You can’t tell and frankly, it’s none of your business if someone is disabled or it is a service dog…last time I checked, passengers don’t own the airline. A service dog can be removed for BAD behavior – lunging, growling, or biting. The airlines, i.e. business owners can enforce this. Maybe we do need to register but how to do this so the people who need a service dog, often one of our poorest groups, are not priced out or timed out for access. The waiting list can be years with costs in the tens of thousands for a dog with an average working life span of 8-10 years. In other countries, see Canada, airlines are required to provide accommodations WITHOUT charge such as another seat for a service dog. Would people be this outraged if a person with a broken leg was accommodated with more leg room? Or would you say, walk instead you loser with a broken leg? What we need to insist on and start holding airlines to is the lack of accommodations provided and the real safety issues with cramming passengers in like sardines!
Reminds of the old joke (found it via Google at https://www.reddit.com/r/Jokes/comments/6xp3qk/two_men_are_walking_their_dogs_a_doberman_and_a/ but I’ve heard variants of this since before the internet existed):
Two men are walking their dogs (a doberman and a chihuahua) when they see a restaurant.
They’re pretty hungry, do they decide to head in for a bite to eat. Unfortunately, they see a sign out front that says “NO DOGS ALLOWED”.
The man with the doberman says “I know what to do, just follow my lead.” He throws on a pair of sunglasses and walks in.
The waiter tells him “I’m sorry sir, we don’t allow dogs here.” The man says “Oh, you don’t understand. I’m blind and this is my guide dog.”
“A doberman for a guide dog?” The waiter asks, skeptical.
“Yes.” The man replies. “Dobermans are very loyal. They’re easy to train and protective too. They’re born for the job.”
The waiter sighs and leads the man to a table.
The second man, excited by this idea, throws on his sunglasses and walks in.
The waiter tells him “I’m sorry sir, we don’t allow dogs here.” The man says “Oh, you don’t understand. I’m blind and this is my guide dog.”
“A chihuahua for a guide dog?” The waiter asks.
“A chihuahua?” The man asks. “They gave me a chihuahua?!”
One strong indicator that an animal is not a service animal, regardless of the particular service they perform, is their behavior.
A service animal will be be attentive to its owner and under control at all times while “on duty”. An animal that is trying to interact with other people or move around on its own is not a service animal and is probably not a responsibly trained emotional support animal either.
If this dog is registered as a service animal and forms were submitted, which is required, then per DOT ruling US airlines are mandated to move a passenger from the bulkhead seat to accomodate this passenger. If this other passenger has a problem with how this was handled they should take it up with DOT and have it looked into. Cannot blame a company for government rules. People who sit in the bulkhead are advised they may be moved, and there is phrasology for it, so who the DOT says need to be accomodated will be or the company will be investigated and fined.
Delta has officially banned emotional support animals. Only certain kinds of animals who the owner swears are service animals by signing a form under the penalty of perjury are allowed.
@Ron Thompson: Great comment, 100 % agreed !!! The FAA should institute a national register of service animals. In addition, the FAA should institute a national policy on the accommodation of overweight people (for all classes below First or Business), for the purposes of Aircraft Safety in the event of an evacuation. It should spell out uniform terms for when an additional seat is to be purchased by them, spell out uniform terms regarding the extent to which any portion of their body may extend into adjacent passenger space, and spell out uniform terms for acceptable seating locations.
Gary – the only thing I have trouble with is that despite his low opinion of you and his certitude that you are not worth his attention, Tim Dunn still seems to be obsessed with you. I’m 76 years old and have met a few people over those years that I don’t like or respect. I STEER CLEAR OF THEM!!! `If he feels the way he does, why continue to read your blogs? It boggles the mind. I am glad that you don’t let his screeds go unanswered.
There are some truly appalling people in this comment thread that make me sad for humanity. The lack of empathy and the vile trash spewing from these people is disturbing and disgusting. I don’t know who hurt you but I hope you get the help you need.
For an elevated, premium travel experience from ATL or SLC, please choose Delta. Whether you invest in the First Class or Basic Economy experience, you are considered a premium guest.
I’d simply refuse to move from my legally purchased and assigned seat. Period.
She was also able to get away with because she is a woman of color and they were afraid of ramifications of saying anything to her.