One simple change Southwest Airlines is working on – and plans to announce later this year – would change their boarding process, and in so doing service to end the phenomenon of passengers faking disabilities to board early, end the practice of seat saving, and make it easier to identify unruly passengers on board.
That change is assigned seats, instead of the current free for all. And Southwest Airlines shared during their earnings calls that they’re looking into changes to how seating works with the specifics to be reveal later at their Investor Day.
In February I explained that the new cabin interiors they revealed gave us a clue for what to expect.
- Thinner seats, while saying they wouldn’t add seats to planes, means more space to use for extra legroom seating probably at the front of the aircraft.
- For these new premium extra legroom seats to make sense, Southwest would have to assign seats rather than making them first-come, first-served.
The airline says they don’t know exactly how a new offering plays out. Clearly there will either be assigned seats for new premium seating, or assigned seats throughout the aircraft. Regardless, assigned seats aren’t just a way to restrict premium seats to customers paying more for them. They are also a way to identify who is sitting in each seat. And that turns out to be useful when running a smooth operation, and dealing with problem passengers.
Fun times on my @SouthwestAir flight. Totally full, one ticketed woman didn’t have a seat so now they have to check everyone’s id to verify they’re supposed to be on the flight. pic.twitter.com/fM8qMj7TN4
— Stephanie L. (@Lady_Stephanie) April 29, 2024
On every other airline, a passenger’s name and seat assignment is on the flight’s manifest for easy identification. Only Southwest Airline’s lacks this information.
- If there are more passengers on the plane than there are supposed to be, you don’t know who is supposed to be there and who isn’t.
- If a passenger in a specific seat is causing problems, you don’t immediately know who it is.
- If a problem passenger doesn’t identify themselves, you need to take everyone off and reboard them to know who’s still on the plane.
After David Dao was dragged off a United Airlines flight and bloodied in 2017, airlines frequently began takig everyone off of the plane rather than taking just one passenger off the plane when someone refused to simply get off when asked to do so. That way they wouldn’t have to have police come on and see matters escalate. United, in particular, became sensitive to having law enforcement on their aircraft for obvious reasons. The Dao story was a global phenomenon, and delayed then CEO Oscar Munoz becoming he airline’s chairman (and therefore likely delayed Scott Kirby from becoming CEO).
However it’s Southwest Airlines that can present the biggest challenge for law enforcement. FBI agents complain that Southwest Airlines is frustrating to deal with in unruly passenger situations on aircraft because passengers can’t easily be identified by their seat assignment.
Of course there are two other huge advantages seat assignments will bring,
- The end of seat saving. No more claiming 13 seats for your group or using a bag of donuts to claim a whole row of seats, and the ensuing conflict that comes from taking more space than your ticket allows.
Woman saving an entire row of plane seats behind her with donut bags.
byu/Hog_Fan inmildlyinfuriating - The end of Jetbridge Jesus flights where dozens of passengers board in wheelchairs, to get on first have their first pick of seats, but walk off just fine at the end of the flight themselves. This won’t just promote fairness, but will stop hogging wheelchairs and staff time pushing those chairs to make them more available for those that really need the assistance.
A friend shares a not-uncommon sight from Puerto Rico:
55 "handicapped" during pre-boarding, including 25 wheel chairs
On his return flight, 15 used wheelchairs to board, only 1 to deboard pic.twitter.com/gHgIsnzsq7
— Bachman (@ElonBachman) February 19, 2023
Another flight on @SouthwestAir, and I’m happy to report being witness to more miracles. These poor souls came seeking a flight, and instead were healed. 🙌🏻🙌🏻
Always grateful for witnessing the miraculous healing power of flight. pic.twitter.com/7TCYn2T6BB
— Dave Ruminates (@dave_ruminates) April 5, 2023
With one simple change – assigned seating – you’ll solve many of the problems that turn boarding a Southwest Airlines flight into an exercise in game theory.
Yes! Assigned seats can’t come soon enough to WN.
If they had assigned seats I might consider flying them.
This will not address the wheelchair fraud. For example Spirit blocks rows 4 and 5 for wheelchair and infant seating , only can be assigned by the gate agent.
WN will as well have to block some seats for legitimate use cases.
@Gary – But doesn’t this create a business problem for Southwest? Isn’t part of their appeal that they are *different* from most carriers, with unassigned seats being part of that appeal? And while they see the revenue potential of differentiated seats, couldn’t that undermine their differentiated brand, leading to direct competition with AA, UA, and DL… eventually causing them to list their fares in the GDS and driving UP their costs instead of controlling them? It’s not like folks searching for “commodity airfare” on Google Flights end up *stumbling upon* Southwest; you have to go to their website to even see prices! Please actively choose to fly them, presumably because they’re different.
I’m sorry, but I am increasingly convinced this is poor decision making by the executive suite, if they choose to go with assigned seats.
WN doesn’t have to go to assigned seats to end the wheelchair fraud. All they have to do is segregate parts of the cabin as premium seating – perhaps w greater pitch – and you can only sit in that section if you have paid for it. On airlines w/ assigned seats, you only sit in the type of seat you pay for. WN’s problem is that every seat is the same – and that has to end for lots of reasons.
I have always believed , perhaps naively, that if WN went to assigned seating and a premium seat option that their attractiveness and profitability would skyrocket. I would love to see something Ala the old AirTran layout – maybe 8 F type seats. Don’t need a dedicated FA , don’t need IFE , and don’t need meals . Just a big seat and maybe free cocktails . They would become my domestic go to airline with a premium cabin – but not necessarily with an F9 euro business – rather a true F product .
@jamesb2147
The differentiation will continue to be free bags. Assigned seating will bring in way more revenue and new passengers than it will lose. (I would consider WN if I could pick my seat, even if I had to pay for it. Right now its a non-starter) They are leaving way too much $$ on the table – ability to pay for extra room and preferred seating will gold mine for them. Those wanna get away fares will become like economy basic with free bags. WN is lagging in revenue/earnings behind the other majors. And with those new huge pilot and FA contracts, they need lots of revenue.
I choose my seat based on the load on each flight. If it’s below 80% I can practically guarantee and empty middle seat by sitting aft of the exit row. If it’s above 90% I might take the exit row middle seat to have legroom. Assigned seating would force me to to make this choice blindly.
Furthermore, if I change my flight time on the day of travel I will almost certainly draw a middle seat, something that currently happens only on a very full flight.
I’m not a fan of assigned seating, but I understand its attraction to people who don’t change their plans and don’t have program status.
Assigned seating carries a cost to the airline in additional staff at the gates to handle seat changes. I agree with Tim Dunn: A limited set of assigned premium seats, with the other seating being open, would minimize this cost.
@Tim Dunn All the majors have “preferred seats” which are sold at a premium that are normal economy seats – such as aisle and window near the front of the cabin. WN should definitely go to assigned seating, this would bring in a lot of business passengers like me who absolutely hate the cattle call. This is about lots of revenue, the end of disability fraud is just a welcome bonus.
Flying as a family with older (but not grown kids), lack of assigned seats is by far my biggest gripe with Southwest. And it’s not like the existing system lives up to their supposed egalitarian ethos, with folks able to pay to get a better boarding position. Good riddance!
I love the open seating concept but this requires honor amongst fliers. There used to be more of it but people have become pigs. I’m okay with assigned boarding if it gets rid of the scammers claiming disability.. it will allow Southwest to better serve those with real needs for assistance and keep flights more on time. I actually avoid some airports now because of the scams.
First of all I agree they need to go to assigned seats for many reasons. They could board just as quickly and SW long ago gave up on 15-20 minute turns of planes (which is one reason Herb went with unassigned seating).
@ed183 – as for “free bags”. SW can advertise that all they want but the majority of travelers don’t pay bag fees on any airline due to status, ticket class purchased, credit card, military etc. this really only plays to the casual traveler looking for the cheapest ticket and frankly no airline (except maybe ULCCs) see that as their core market. SW clearly doesn’t hence their push to ass more benefits for business travelers.
Southwest could do what Hawaiian Airlines does: Hawaiian’s basic economy fare doesn’t allow you to pre-select your seat–you have to pay extra to choose certain seats at the time of booking. The passengers who don’t pay to select a seat are assigned one when they check in for their flight and get their boarding passes. I found out how that works because that’s how it worked for a friend who was on the same flight as me; I’d paid for my seat, but she had not, so she found out where she’d be sitting after she checked in.
It’s about time. I won’t fly SWA anymore due to lack of assigned seating. Let’s get with the times. The current system is a disaster
If SW had assigned seats, I might consider flying them more. As it is, the 24 hour check-in lottery, the standing in line, the not knowing what you’re going to get make SW a second tier choice for me most of the time. With AA status, I get free bags and free seat assignments, that often makes it a cheaper option that SW and a more attractive one. I only pick SW if it is better for my schedule by a lot. Otherwise, pass.
As someone who has a chronic illness and battles fatigue, I can explain the “wheelchair only on departure” phenomenon. At my home airport, Atlanta, you have to be able to walk upwards of 6,500 steps to get to the ticket counter, check in, walk to security, and then walk to the train and over to your gate. That’s not possible for many of us who can walk short distances but not to the end of the moon and back. At many away airports, I have only about 500 steps to walk, so I don’t need a wheelchair on arrival as much as I do at my home airport. I therefore will have them cancel the chair upon arrival so I can just walk to the curb. Based on my own experience, it’s impossible to know whether people are telling the truth or lying when there are so many at the gate. The carrier therefore has to assume people will tell the truth and play accommodation theater so they aren’t fined by the DOT in case they guess wrong. Meanwhile, 25% of the US has some sort of disability, so there’s that.
I personally would fly SWA more if it was assigned seating. I’m at the age where I’ll pay more for seat certainty than a free for all. Maybe I’m in the minority?
@AC Bag fees account for like 4%+ of all airline revenue. There are many many people who still pay to check bags. This all comes back to where WN is leaving ton’s of revenue on the table. Since their Chase card’s give no real benefit beyond earning from swipes, the incentive keep those cards is pretty low after you have gotten the SUB. How many people who are getting free checked bags are getting them from holding a CC, my guess would be the lions share of them.
If higher tier WN status members got preferred/premium seating free I would think that it would drive increased CC spending towards status more than better a cattle call number.
In the post covid world and in the face of other Airlines tweaking their FF/CC programs to maximize revenue – WN needs to evolve also.
Is there data out there of how much revenue WN will trade off from all those early bird and A1-15 check in fees?
I just want to shoutout to Alex’s comment above about chronic illness/fatigue and wheelchair usage. As the spouse of someone with chronic illness there are times when a wheelchair is necessary and sometimes when it is preferred to forego it. There are good days and bad days. Many illnesses are invisible and it is not fair to judge a wheelchair user by whether they can walk or not. That said, I know there are scammers out there and we perhaps would despise them more than most because of how they invite undeserved judgement for those with true wheelchair needs (invisible or otherwise).
@Alex My empathy for your personal struggles. But the reality is that according to almost all commenters here, WN generally has many more disability assist passengers then other airlines. This is because there is a outsized incentive to ask for an assist due to the ability to board even before the highest paying/status flyers and pick the best seats. If a person needs an assist, WN going to assigned seating shouldn’t change that dynamic one iota. They would just get on first and go to their assigned seat like all other airlines.
I refuse to fly Southwest because I want to have an assigned aisle seat at the time of booking. I don’t want to play all those games to get priority boarding and dealing with seat saving. I know a lot of other people who feel the same. I am willing to pay more for an economy comfort seat up front with a bit more leg room.
Yes, the free for all seating made them different, but who does it really appeal to? Is it worth driving away a significant part of the flying public, especially the part who might pay more for the seat they prefer?
Wouldn’t it be nice to go back to picking a free seat assignment. We continue to moan and groan, and whoever thought of the idea of paying for a ticket and then paying for a seat should have been aborted. Ahhhhh, the good ol days.
I do not/will not fly WN. I have a balance problem as well as other ailments.
I fly DL and always in first/business class, It is necessary for me to use a wheelchair. I ALWAYS put it in my reservation and there is almost (90%) of the time a wheelchair at the gate on arrival. The people that decide to ask for a wheelchair at the airport are mostly scamming the system, shame on them.
If you truly need assistance, make it known in your reservation.
Health conditions dictate that I must use a wheelchair when traveling to and from by air. I request it in my reservation to meet me at the curb and, in accordance with airline policy, take me to the curb upon landing. SW has always been really good about this, but I’m amazed at how many people do abuse this system. I’ve seen people get pushed to the gate, then get up and go eat and go shopping with their family and then rush back to sit down when boarding is announced. SMH. Too bad the gate agent can’t take action on this
Also, SW should limit the number of people who can board with the disabled passenger to one. I’ve seen large groups get on with the “disabled” person because they couldn’t be separated or they had their.meds. It’s extremely frustrating to see this abuse of the system. I gladly trade my situation to be able to wait in line like I used to, but I can’t.
It better bring in big revenue because it will wipe out their Early Bird fees. I stopped flying WN when I was paying for Early Bird and getting B-forty-something boarding places.
The huge number of wheelchair passengers is my pet peeve and there needs to be a better way to do this, perhaps they need a Dr note or have it noted on the ticket at purchase instead of at the counter or going to the gate agent. I get claustraphopic so I’ve always paid to be able to board in the A group to pick a window seat close the front of the plane so I can get off quickly but lately I’m lucky if I can get a window seat 10 rows back when I pay $50 for EB. It used to be around A20 or earlier before they started sellling upgrades to a A1-15 but I haven’t seen that available the last few times I’ve flown anyway.
I’ve been flying WN since you needed to arrive at the airport well ahead of your flight to wait in line and it was first come, first serve. Then they changed to an assigned boarding # process and I used a free service to get it for me as I could not always check in at the exact to the second flight time due to meetings etc. When they blocked that, I paid for it and now I’m lucky if I can get around A50.
I have never seen as many wheelchairs as I have over the last few years. It’s common knowledge all they need to do is say they need a preboard and they receive it with no questions asked. It’s always frustrating when you see 20+ wheelchairs or preboards waiting at the front of the line and when the flight arrives at its destination there are maybe 2-3 in the jetway and many of those passengers that needed the wheelchair had no issue walking off the plane. I’ve been lucky to grab an open bulkhead seat a couple of times and watched them walk on the jetway without any issue. I know there are some legitimate reasons but this is WAY out of hand, especially in states like AZ and FL.
Add another +1 for assigned seating. It’s the main reason why I and many others won’t fly them. And AFAIK, they are the only major US carrier that does not offer assigned seats, so where are all those crazies who like their chaotic seating going to go?
The way to get the wheelchair scammers is to board them after the A group. I bet nearly all will suddenly be cured!
About damn time. You just knew it would eventually come to this.
kick the proles to the curb!
kettles be gone!
bridge and tunnel to the other side of the river!
thank god
this will also drive down F fares at fortress hubs and allow travelers like myself the ability to PAY for an aisle seat with enough room to open my laptop and guarantee i’ll have my bag over my head – that’s all i ask – and i’ve been having to pay to ride legacy F simply to guarantee those 3 things happen on every flight
if i can’t get forked by other random luv policies – i might come back
on please southwest – put in a real F cabin! – GO THE DISTANCE
Yes, Southwest Airlines needs to assign seats, charge for checked bags and do what the other airlines do (sarcasm). Really a type of situation that allows a lot of assigned seat fans to have more choices in flying while forcing the minority of customers who like Southwest style seating to have no choice. I think Southwest should stay the course and figure out some other way to limit the abuses to the seating policy.
Loving all the “I’m not the scammer….THEY’RE the scammer!” comments.
Yes. WN needs to assign seats.
If you NEED a certain seat, PAY for it.
As far as limiting how many scammers can preboard: they can’t because of the ACAA. This is new America, you can’t even misgender someone’s dog, what makes you think that you can keep the 94% of Americans that are “disabled” (including the new fad of “hidden” disabilities) from gaming the system and screwing everyone else in the process? You can pay for a seat and preboard. Otherwise, enjoy Seat 27E. I’ll even help you, your sunflower lanyard, and 3 service pitbulls get back there.
It’s past time that they did this. The boarding experience has diminished quite a bit over the years. As far as earnings the ways I see WN bringing in more cash would be to start charging for the second bag. Two free bags means extra fuel costs one should be enough in the domestic market. If WN could start charging for the second bag, they would still offer more than most airlines with 1 free checked bag for everyone. The savings in fuel burn from people traveling lighter or choosing to pay for the second bag would mean a win either way for WN. They cannot continue to operate the same with higher cost of labor and fuel.
It was my understanding that the assigned seats were only going to be the first 5 rows and the exits only. A comfort plus idea and then general boarding for everything else. Like a first class line, you can board whenever you like and your seat will be waiting for you.
Anyone remember this? Herb Kelleher, Southwest’s CEO, was a Wild Turkey bourbon aficionado and appreciated the value of a nice bottle of liquor. He proposed that Southwest offer its passengers an option: either pay a discounted price, or pay full fare and get a free gift. Choices included: a fifth of Chivas Regal Scotch, Crown Royal, Smirnoff, or even a leather ice bucket. About three-quarters of Southwest’s passengers were traveling businessmen at the time and they flocked to Southwest and happily paid full fare on their “company’s expense accounts” to claim the free bottles of booze. They gave away so many, for a moment, Southwest Airlines became the largest distributor of premium liquor in Texas.
Assigned seats PLEASE. And Reduce the SELFISH behavior of hogging the whole row. And I just might consider flying with them again.
G2, an airport handler, charges the airlines $76.00 PER WHEELCHAIR request. PER CHAIR!
I think its time that the airlines get exempted from the ADA and make people who need WCHR service PAY for it.
I like SWA current process of boarding- it’s simple and efficient and mostly fair.
If anyone listened to the conference call this assigned seat play appears to be a revenue hail mary. I suspect many comments are coming from infrequent SW flyers. Those that know, know that picking your seat, being a.list, paying 20.00 when you need to, but not when you dont is optimal
They broke their model years ago when they expanded and went into airports they originally said they’d never go to. Now they’re becoming more and more like their competition. Before you know it they’ll actually give you the whole can of Coke when you ask for one! Share buy backs and increased bonuses for the upper management tier have taken then to where they are now… Worried about revenue and wondering how to squeeze more out the customer while still trying to say they’re better and different from the others when in reality they aren’t. Their price isn’t so low anymore, especially for a sub par product. It’s a 1967 era aircraft.
I hate non-assigned seating! The last time I was on a SW flight was 7/2023, and I bought two RT “business class” seats (big deal) from PHX to BWI. I also bought BC on two previous flts. The reason I paid more for each segment was because SW states BC boards first. NO TRUE! BC boards after the scammers and the crew they bring along to assist them? Not just one person, an entire family from teens to toddlers, and grandparents! Then comes the families with small children who need extra time, then military (no issues there), then elite passenger or whatever SW calls them, and then finally BC! Even though we were A 2&3, by the time we boarded, half the plane was full! No more SW for us. My SW Chase card expires in November, and I’m canceling it before then. I would have done it last year, but forgot. I was reminded when I was dinged another $95 for the privilege of a SW card! Even if SW started assigning seats, we still won’t fly on that airline, ever again!
I never thought I would lose faith in Southwest Airlines. But here we are. They have always been the airline I loved to fly but I have never liked assigned seats when I was forced to fly other carriers. And, seriously, just what will they do with passengers who legitimately need that wheelchair? Just how do they think assigned seats will stop the scammer?
This decision dishonors the Founder of Southwest Airlines.
First of all, part of the reason WN has free for all is because they are lazy/cheap and won’t upgrade their software what can actually assign seats.
Second, an easy way to stop wheelchair scammers is to take their cabin bags from them and stash wayyyy in the back, or in the hold., then make them wait for it for 30 minutes, just before the next flight leaves, to get it.
Yes it will inconvenience genuine cases but I am mildly sure they want to put an end to this scam too.
I personally love open seating because I can almost always snag an exit row as an A lister or with a simple upgrade to early bird.
When I travel with my wife or a companion, I save a single seat next to me at no additional cost. I know some people will hate that, but it’s economical.
Changing this will make the cost of flying WN more expensive and factor into my choice of airline.
Assigned seating is good for shareholders and those traveling on an expense budget, not so much for the avg flyer.
Good! Maybe I will consider flying SW again. The whole free for all seating thing is ridiculous.
@Mangos – That’s not how the Southwest boarding process works: https://support.southwest.com/helpcenter/s/article/boarding-process
To summarize,
1) Pre-boards (folks in wheelchairs + party, though I’ve seen the party limited to one person by the GA sometimes)
2) Group A (“business class” is specifically A1-15, so very first on after wheelchairs)
3) Those requiring extra time (families, non-qualifying medical), elites, and military
4) Group B
5) Group C
I call this out so that others aren’t misled by your misinformation.
This change is a ruse to charge more for seats. I have flown SW every week for years. The number of times I have seen the types of tactics can be counted on one hand.
I don’t mind the seating policy but my wife refuses to fly SWA because of this. We never check bags so there’s zero value in that for us. Count us in the “change the policy” camp!
As a flight attendant for Southwest I will say that going to assigned seating will destroy one of the things that diferentiates us from the other carriers. Many fly us strictly for that Freedom. Now there are pros and cons to everything and I’m all for assigned seating as well, but I’m also one for not destroying one of the core values or what makes us stand out from other airlines. But then also it’s a different flying world than it was in the 80s and 90s. And the traveling public have anger all built inside ready to explode on anyone. I see it out there.
We have flown southwest before, and it is very frustrating to see those abuse the system. Yes, I do know there are diseases that are unseen. But when my husband, who is a disabled veteran and uses an upwalker because he needs a few extra minutes to board get on with 25 wheelchairs and only 2 need it getting off, yes it’s infuriating!
There are airlines that let the spouse or 1 other person board with the disabled. We would gladly pay for assigned seating on southwest. We currently fly Delta, pay for delta comfort+ and do not pay for bags because we carry delta credit card.
I honestly don’t know what the solution to this problem is.