A flight attendant working for a budget airline – probably Spirit or Frontier – shared that on a flight last month a mother and her 3 year old son showed up at their assigned seats and found that a ‘plus-size passenger’ was at the window, spilling significantly into the middle seat.
The child exclaimed, “Mommy, there’s only one,” pointing to the aisle seat, since there was no real space left in the middle. The mother apologized immediately.
Since the flight wasn’t full, the flight attendant reseated the mother and child, and offered the plus-sized woman a complimentary beverage. On a fee-based airline!
Just before the aircraft door’s closed, the woman rang her call button and loudly asked, “Are you going to bring me a seatbelt extension or are you just enjoying humiliating me?” That got the attention of the surrounding rows.
- The flight attendant explained that those are only provided on request. She immediately fetched one for the woman.
- As the woman deplaned at the end of the flight, she told the flight attendant she’d be reported “to the ADA.”
Hello, ADA? Yes, Karen here from the plane… please send her straight to jail.
The flight attendant is correct here. The Americans With Disabilities Act isn’t the relevant statute, nor is there ‘an ADA’ to report violations to. Instead, the Air Carrier Access Act controls. Obesity alone is not generally treated as a protected disability unless linked to a separate medical condition. And passengers who need accommodations – like a seatbelt extender – must request them. Airlines aren’t required to anticipate needs. And proactively suggesting accommodations can just as easily offend!
Here, the woman drew extra attention to her situation – if anything declaring loudly and drawing in the rest of the cabin would be what drove any humiliation. She could have asked discretely for what she needed. And she wasn’t required to buy two seats even though she extended into the adjacent seat. She should have said thank you?
A request for a seatbelt extension is typically treated under “special assistance” rather than disability as such. Generally, discrimination law requires accommodation. It’s not something that the person in need of the accommodation receives as a ‘favor’. However – and I should probably put on the flame retardant jacket before saying this – I do think accommodations should be appreciated and people ought not be presumptuous and assuming when making the request. Even where accommodations are required, there ought to be a thank you involved.
And there’s something about 3 year olds, though, that can’t help but speak truth. G.K. Chesterton once wrote, “For children are innocent and love justice, while most of us are wicked and naturally prefer mercy.”
Too often demands escalate. I tend here to think of Munich Syndrome (appeasement increases aggression) leads to “Big Curvy Olivia” calling it discrimination that aircraft aisles are so narrow, posting video of herself struggling to get through a United Airlines Polaris business class cabin. But widened aisles would mean even less room for seats, which would surely be discriminatory to her, too!
Lol and the First Class cabin has much more space than economy pic.twitter.com/YCAh501hF3
— Ben Kew 🏌️♂️ (@ben_kew) May 18, 2023
Indeed, some ‘plus-sized influencers’ think that airlines should just give them extra space for free, the way that Southwest has done for years, but that means amortizing the cost of a flight across fewer passengers and a need to generate higher revenue from each one. (Southwest has had lower load factors so the marginal cost to them has often been zero.)
That’s just another form of cost-shifting – higher fares- albeit less directly than a single passenger stealing space from the passenger next to them because they don’t fit.
(HT: Paul H.)
Bout that time of the week… Fat folks on planes… classic! Do ‘dogs on planes’ next! It’s been a while…
FFS, the airlines should be putting the pax AND their luggage on a scale together and charging by the pound. When you buy your “ticket” it’s simply a holding deposit, the final amount is determined by the cargo tare weight of your chubby bumpkin plus all your indispensable accoutrements.
Heck, they could even make some extra coin by opening it up to wagering a la “Guess My Weight”. How much chunky on that monkey!
We all know if you asked her if she needed an extender or brought her one without her requesting it, there’s a good chance that would be wrong as well.
You know if you don’t like a topic you needn’t craft a Statler/Waldorf post?
My issue here is always with the airline, and why staff always looks the other way. Just like the kid can tell, FAs and GAs can always tell when a person needs two seats. Yet they pretend they don’t notice so they’re not accused of fat shaming. Instead they push the problem onto you and me to deal with it for 4 uncomfortable hours. Do your job. Either tell the woman “sorry, but you need to buy two seats”, or find another job.
My first question, if I were the airline’s legal representation, would be if the beverage was water, coffee, tea (either “unsweet” or herbal only), carrot juice, or otherwise anything else that’s sugar free.
This could have happened on any airline. I feel for all three passengers being in a difficult situation.
The fat shaming here by (what I am assuming are all men) is disgusting. It isn’t necessary to make fun of or bully people because of the way they look. While her attitude stood a lot to be desired, I’ve known large people – men and women – who have medical issues and cannot lose weight. Speaking of shaming, most of you here should be (a)shamed. I quite literally am embarrassed for you. Try a little kindness.
I love a kid’s honesty. Is refreshing in a world full of snowflakes.
As with cargo, certain items should only be shipped via ground.
Years ago, my elderly mother — who, shall we say, “widened with age” — was flying with our family. She settled into her seat and immediately began complaining to my wife and me that the airline had shrunk the size of the seatbelts. The more we explained, “No they haven’t — let’s get an extender”, the more loudly she complained. A very sweet and patient FA helped us out, but even after she was buckled in, she kept loudly complaining to us about “how much money do they think they save with smaller seatbelts?”
All yall bleeding hearts defending this behavior and commenting anonymously….
NOPE I DONT FEEL BAD. If they spill into MY SEAT I am saying something!
“Body shaming” might be the only way some of these WHALES consider their health and do something about their morbid obesity. STOP DEFENDING UNHEALTHY BEHAVIOR
@Thing 1 — I feel for you. Caring for aging parents, especially those that are ‘less than appreciative,’ that is real work. *sigh*
FA missed an opportunity:
“Are you gonna bring me an extender??”
“Yes, ma’am. How many would you like?”
Nobody is fat shaming, we’re entitlement shaming.
Good thing this happened past the metal detectors so no democrat could shoot the kid for saying something mean and hurtful
The gravitationally challenged person crying about a seat belt has bigger problems to worry about.
6.6743 × 10-11 m3 kg-1 s-2
Spilling over into two seats should cost two fares. Why should the rest of us be burdened with paying for their lack of calorie control.
@anon — Nice sunglasses.
It would be rude and obnoxious of me to say this woman should have been offered space in cargo where her attitude would not bother any humans. I totally agree with what you wrote especially in re to being appreciative and offering a simple thank you. Or should we expect the airlines to leave extenders at every seatback to add weight which burns more fuel and will leave to increased pricing especially when it becomes a souvenir du jour and they are stolen?
Big however: As boarding was underway the FA’s could/should have noticed the likelihood of this woman’s needs and perhaps offered one, though always at the risk of someone feeling insulted. Crews do not have crystal balls, and many passengers lack common sense and courtesy.
Fat asses seem to “think” they are special, when in reality they are just slobs. “F” them.
An entitled person in a spiteful world (per the comments). The easiest way to have this as a nonissue in most cases is to spend only a little and buy airplanes with slightly longer seatbelts (the seatbelt fabric is fairly cheap). I know from personal experience years ago that all airplane seatbelts are not the same length. Some are quite short and others are sufficiently long. I also know through personal experience that some flight attendants are better at getting seatbelt extenders for you, even when asked politely. Some will forget you asked. I also know from personal experience that you can buy a seatbelt extender that is as robust as the ones on the airplane. Further there are only two types needed to work on almost every commercial passenger airplane designed in the Americas or Western Europe.
The old parody group Capitol Steps had a song in 2001-2 on their CD Between Iraq and a Hard Place called “You Cant Fly with Giant Thighs” sung to You Cant Hide Your Lyin Eyes.
A hilarious song
“The fat shaming here by (what I am assuming are all men) is disgusting.”
Blaming all men, nice.
“Try a little kindness.”
Try it yourself, manhating princess. This is VFTW, not “How I hate all men because they fat shame me and the other fat women.”
I’ll take an obese person next to me anytime over a woman with feminine hygiene odor and issues. God almighty. The most horrific smell on an airplane.
I am obese. “Skinny” is not in my gene pool. But I NEVER have and NEVER will use my size to get sympathy or an extra seat at no charge. I PLAN, I PAY if there is an additional charge for my “fat ass”, & I request a seat belt extender once I get on the plane. I have never had an issue with anyone because I am not blind to the fact that sometimes my ass won’t fit in that seat & ONLY I can make it work & not humiliate myself or anybody else.
If a person is so large that they cannot fit into an individual seat, then they should book 2 seats or sit in a larger seat up front.
When booking, the potential passenger should be asked if they can fit into a single seat or if they need adjacent seats.
I don’t feel the need to fat shame anyone. On the other hand, a person of such size should also be sensitive to the need or fellow passengers and not to encroach upon their space. People pay for a seat with its space, not a fraction thereof.
Suppose passengers with morbid obesity, classified as Class III obesity (a body mass index of 40 or higher), buy plus-size clothing for their travel. Before their flight, these passengers also purchase their own FAA-approved personal seatbelt extender. Would airlines object to or deny the use of a passenger-owned seatbelt extender?
like size bins for carry on, the airlines should have an empty economy seat at the gate, if the person can’t fit in…….
It’s simple… your ticket rents you a space. If you can’t contain your girth in that space, rent more space. Other people shouldn’t pay for your problem.
Why should we all pay extra for the, ahem, generously proportioned? Airlines could have oversized seats that cost more and reserve them for the biggies. If not taken by X number of days before takeoff, they become premium seats up for grabs to anyone who wants to buy them.
If you rent a storage unit, and your stuff doesn’t fit in it, you don’t get to overflow into the neighboring unit. You rent a second storage unit, or a larger one. Period. Have seats at check-in or the gate like Disney rides. “You must be this small to ride.” Or pay by weight/fuel cost.
When the reality is fst people are too big snd need to buy a second seat but they try to nske this about fat shaming!
Fatties have issues and their weight vauses diabetes and other health related issues.
Its as bad as people who dont understand the differences bwtween men and women. The woke left has everyone confused.
Fat people …Toughen up and take personal responsibility. Dont blame the other passengers who cant get in the seat they paid for. Dont blame the airline or flight attendant. Dont blame the aircraft manufacterers. Blame yourself and take responsibility! The insanity muat end. You cant fit? Dont stress.. just loose weight or dont fly!
I love the comment about rented storage units! If a passenger cannot fit in the space available, then they buy an extra seat. Passengers bringing their own seat belt extender opens a liability can of worms. Like the moron who sued McDonalds because the customer spilled hot coffee on herself, ya gotta remember, this is a litigious society.
Lol! Forget bag sizers as you board. Need a size for passengers! If you don’t fit, you don’t go without buying a extra seat!
I was always wondering… in terms of safety… if plus-sized passengers usually get stuck on their seat, what happens in case of an emergency ?
I am not fat. I am tall-normal (6 ft). Whenever available, I get, and pay for, an “extra leg room seat.”
Who will be the first carrier to offer, at additional cost, “extra butt room seats.” and enforce “no spill over” in regular fare seats?
Flatbed trailers exist for a reason.
Way back in the Golden Age of Flying most seats were far enough apart on all sides that a “plus sized” fellow passenger would not bother anyone. Now that fifty times more people are travelling by air, and the airlines are determined to grab every cent from us, we not only have to “carry on” our 40 pound suitcase, but squeeze into a seat with the seat back ahead in our nose — before it is “reclined”.
Win Whitmire, you should read about Liebeck v. McDonald’s Restaurants (the “moron” and McDonald’s). Hot coffee shouldn’t result in an injury bad enough to require skin grafts.
******
Instead of scales, have two sets of two poles each – the first set as wide apart as one seat, the second set as wide apart as two seats. Let passengers choose which to walk between. If they pick the first set, they can board and go to the single seat they purchased. If they pick the second, they’ll need to add a second seat. No confrontation, no shame, all of the decision making is on the passenger.
I haven’t figured out a solution for when someone gets wedged between the first tow poles. Maybe an alarm that says, “one at a time, please” if there’s too much pressure on the poles?
Per today’s culture losing weight is simply out of the question.
@George Nathan Romey — Obviously, not the case. (See: Gary. Well done, sir!)
Responding to Sue:
I applaud you in acknowledging the truth. Should you be plus size/obese, you need to be honest with yourself and purchase the extra seat.
All the other posts are about fat shaming or Karen shaming and misses the point of the article.
Hi Gary,
While I like your analytical reports of domestic and foreign airlines and some really good insightful posts about state of travel, I don’t understand why you delve into social media hype about misbehaving passengers and such? I guess you are out of ideas/materials for posts on daily basis, but you don’t need to post daily.
Please sick to topics that are not derogatory to your statue as an expert – don’t low yourself to media hype and gossip. YOU CAN DO BETTER than that!!!
By posting such hype on Boarding Area and your blog site, you downgrading both.
Are you overweight? Ask yourself why? emotional? Fix it. Undisciplined? Fix it . If you have to physically perform to survive then you have less chance than the fitter people. Just stop eating so much. Your body cannot process the calories. Feel sorry you’re fat? Suck it up. I’ve been too heavy. I lost it. As far as airlines are concerned they enforce bag size so enforce people fit in the seat sizes. If I ever survive an aircraft accident and I’m hindered from escape I will invoke my survival rights and climb right over the blockage.
@Alex — He knows; yet, we all should know that in this attention economy, there must be outrage to fuel and subsidize the good content. So, I’ve learned to embrace the slop. Yumyum. Anyway, what’s that saying from The Borg, “You will be assimilated. Resistance is futile.”
It’s not fat shaming to tell someone they have to buy two seats. Nobody cares WHY you’re fat. We care that you’re taking up someone else’s space and pretending it isn’t a problem. Being fat doesn’t give you the right of putting your culo in someone else’s lap. Either buy two seats, or lose weight. You can’t have it both ways, and calling it out isn’t fat shaming, no matter how much you want to call it that.
Feel about this however you want. I don’t really care. It sucks to have a passenger intruding on your space, but I click through the affiliate links to get miles so that I can sit up in J and F.
But it’s ludicrous how so many of society’s most disgraceful people use the ADA and ACAA as a cudgel to force their own accommodations rather than a shield to protect those with actual disabilities where accommodation is necessary. People sizers like bag sizers would solve this once and for all, but airlines are afraid of the mass of people who will file an ADA suit. As I said in the fake “”Service Dog”” article, I’m surprised this administration isn’t taking the low lying fruit given putting a stop to this nonsense would fit well with the War on Woke, but I suppose selfish jerks are truly bipartisan.
The policy across all airlines should be if you take up more than ine seat you have to pay for two or you will not be let on the plane. Yes, it’s draconian, but why should the next passenger suffer. These people know they will be an inconvenience to the next person, they just don’t care
I don’t see why Horizontally-enhanced Karen is complaining here. The flight attendant quietly reseated the OTHER PASSENGERS and didn’t make HER move seats.
I might be inclined to tell the person a seat belt extender might be the least of her worries. After all she’ll only be 7 miles above the ground. Held up by nothing but a half dozen soda can thicknesses of Aluminum. Traveling 10 mile a minute. Unable to see where she is going. And if she has to get off the thing in a hurry she has only 90 seconds to do it. Through a kitchen cabinet size door. Across a slippery wing. 15 feet off the ground.
The FA should have told the ” ‘plus-sized” person to buy an extra seat or be escorted off the airplane.
@Movedright
You actually moved wrong. You know as well as everyone else that RW nutcase violence FAR exceeds the left. You just want something else to cry about.
“Way back in the Golden Age of Flying most seats were far enough apart on all sides that a ‘plus sized’ fellow passenger would not bother anyone.” Nope. Seat pitch is less, but the problem is lateral spread. Old 707s, 727s, and 737s had more narrow interior cabins than modern 737s. The 320 series is wider yet. Still coach was 3-3 then and now. Where did that seat width you think they took away go? [N.B. Old and new 737s have the same exterior width, the newer 737s have thinner non-structural walls.]
@jns has it right. As a formerly fat person with a metabolic disorder who at times needed an extender although did not spill over like is being discussed I can tell you that 1) my dream seat was always the one with the metal “wall” between the bottom of the seats at the bulkhead. That way there was no problem or worry on either side about “spill.” And 2) FAs forgot after I asked all the time. All the time! And it is embarrassing to ask discreetly and to keep having to do so while trying to respect that the FA has other duties and may must need a second. It’s a tough one to navigate and I suspect what happened here. Finally, I have brought my own extender only to be told that its regulation to only use theirs so…what can I say?
“my dream seat was always the one with the metal ‘wall’ between the bottom of the seats at the bulkhead.” Don’t give good ideas away for free! Make certain non-bulkhead Y rows with the immovable arm rests. We need a good name (“non-spillover seats” doesn’t have the right ring). I’ll give up the lost seat width not to have contact with the seat mate whether it be because of their width or desire to spread.
This is a classic example of the company creating a condition that shrinks space for everyone. I have worked in the Airline Business for 40 years and my father before me, so I rode Space available back to the 70’s. Seat Pitch (space fore and aft used to be 33″ now it is 30″ the width has changed by only slightly. All seat belts are a standard size. The extender has been around for decades. The big difference today, is the load factor. During regulation planes were 75% full on most flights. Today that number is 95%. This means the majority of flights are 100% full no extra seats.
The company is telling you it is your fellow passenger, when it is smaller for everyone. More people are travelling and think it is a right, but it has always been a privilege. Carriers will kick you off for small infractions these days.
Now I do agree that those that are challenged by these seats should buy an extra seat or move to first class where there is much more room per passenger.
I’m tall. I want extra legroom for free. I was born this way. Fat is a choice
One thing’s for sure….if it comes down to you or the Person of Size, the FA won’t take YOUR side.
One time when I got to my row, the window seat (mine) and the aisle were taken up by a HUGE couple. I politely said, “I think I have the window seat” and the female, not even looking at me, said, “Move to another seat; my husband isn’t moving.” Not that I was going to fight for THAT seat, of course, they were nearly side-by-side in those three seats.
I flagged down an FA and she said, “Go ahead and sit somewhere else.” “Where?”, I asked. “Just sit somewhere, we’re not full” was her answer as she turned away and went back up the aisle. Problem there was where? I figured wherever I sat, someone was going to come and say, “You’re in my seat!”
So, I stood at the back of the plane until boarding was completed and then took an empty seat. Middle, of course.
As I said, don’t expect help from the FA. She/he is not going to take a chance on getting the P.O.S. riled up.
@Glly, I bought two seatbelt extenders but both of the same model as I determined that model was the correct one for the airplanes I was flying (the second was a backup). I never asked permission to use my own seatbelt extender and the flight attendants never gave more than a cursory glance to check if my seatbelt was on. There was definitely a difference in seatbelt length between some airplanes. Usually the small regional jets had the shorter seatbelts and the twin aisle ones were best at having longer seatbelts. Some flight attendants seemed stingy on getting seatbelt extenders. A few were proactive. Fortunately I have lost weight so I no longer carry my personal seatbelt extender with me.
‘Fat’ is almost always a choice. Using a fictitious medical condition to explain a vast, immense and inconsiderate body is pure nonsense. If the overly large want to use the facilities of the normal, they should pay extra is they don’t fit. Why should those who can refuse food bear the cost – however slight – of those on a ‘see it- eat it’ diet?
Got my laugh from the first post. #1990. right on!
If you want to be fat then go for it.
But you don’t get to steal space from others or bully flight crews.
Another example of America today. I have all rights and no responsibilities. Government, employer, you name it must fix everything for me. i have no agency.
@jns I assumed the same thing and thought the personal extender would be fine, never occurred to me the airline might be picky about the “right” one, but I was challenged twice on it. It was also a relief for me not to have to carry it around anymore. With the FAs I got the impression they were more in get the plane off the ground mode and just forgot sometimes. I was also told a couple of times that the extender was what they were going to use in the safety demonstration and I would have to wait.
@Jaya I think this is more about FAs never, ever helping on seat change issues. I was in economy years ago on an 11hour long haul flight and the sound on my entertainment system wasn’t working. The FA verified this and said that I should just switch seats, but it was up to me. So, in the middle of this 11 hour flight,
I just show up and sit next to someone and piss them off (this was when I was at a normal weight, I note)? She just shrugged. This was on KLM and I’ve never flown them again.
@This comes to mind I would have happily paid extra to always sit in a seat like this. Or happy to have that be the default with seats. I doubt it will get much sympathy but I traveled a lot for work and they insisted on buying these terrible agency-purchased codeshare flights. And it kept happening that no matter what I did, I simply couldn’t upgrade the flight to get more space. I would show up in Frankfurt and Lufthansa would say well this is a united flight and we can’t do anything and no one from United is here. Call United and they say you have to deal with it at the airport. Go to the gate and United says well we don’t have access to the system, it’s not the same. It was very frustrating as I dreaded feeling uncomfortable and making other people uncomfortable but felt like I couldn’t fix it. And no my company did not have an accommodations policy if you were overweight. I hated it.
@NoName — The irony is that literally soon after this Gary did in-fact post a ‘dogs on planes’ post.
This should be a very simple solution…if you can’t fit into one seat without spilling over into the adjacent seat, you need to buy two seats. Someone’s weight issues shouldn’t be anyone else’s problem. Someone wearing size xxxxxxl is going to pay more for their clothes too. If your size requires more of anything, you should pay more. I should not lose half my seat because you can’t fit into one.
BTW… what are “plus-sized influencers” influencing? I can only imagine.
Most Americans are overweight and many, way more than is healthy. That is a fact. They don’t fit into the seats or even into the tiny bathrooms. Yet, our airlines keep making the seats smaller and smaller and they get away with it because the government lets them. It should be mandated by law that more room be given on plane seats and bathrooms to accommodate the actual size of most Americans. If fares have to rise a bit, so be it. Everyone will have a more comfortable and safe ride, thin or big.
@Glly says: [@jns I assumed the same thing and thought the personal extender would be fine, never occurred to me the airline might be picky about the “right” one, but I was challenged twice on it. It was also a relief for me not to have to carry it around anymore. With the FAs I got the impression they were more in get the plane off the ground mode and just forgot sometimes. I was also told a couple of times that the extender was what they were going to use in the safety demonstration and I would have to wait.]
I would put the actions of the flight attendants as trying to fat sham you. I’m sure that you have seen that undertone from a lot of the comments. I was never challenged on using my personal extender and the flight attendants didn’t seem to care enough to do a real inspection. Of course, where the two buckles were may have had something to do with the personal extender not being easy to spot. Most seatbelts in airplanes are black so that is the preferred color. Leave one buckle showing on the aisle side and cover the other one, with it being as far away as possible. Usually not a problem for me as I have a waist bag that contains money, tickets, cellphones, etc. and it covers what is in front. There is probably a required minimum number of extenders per every 100 seats or fraction thereof. The safety demonstration excuse may have been a canard. As far as I know passengers are suppose to be buckled in before the airplane leaves the gate and the safety demonstration is after the airplane leaves the gate. Just another thing for the flight attendant to forget while trying to get everything done and get seated in a jump seat. A seatbelt extender has another use beyond when being seated. If there are a lot of empty seats and you can get three in a row to lie down, the seatbelt extender can allow you to more comfortably be strapped in while lying down and sleeping.
@jns could be on the fat shaming issue, but usually I didn’t get that impression–and I will note this also happened in *First*…so little incentive there for them one would think. With the extenders, it was more curiosity like it never occurred to them someone would bring their own. I’m not an FA apologist, but I have been frustrated at the scatter-brained nature of some of them…never got a fat shaming vibe, more an annoyance like the annoyance of any special request.